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[ TOWN OF GREENBURGH OFFICE OF THE TOWN BOARD 177 Hillside Avenue, Greenburgh, NY 10607 Tel: 914-989-1500 Fax: 914-993-1541 Email: JDudek@Greenburghny.com https://ny-greenburgh.civicplus.com/485/Watch-Live-Board-Meetings]
AFTERNOON.UH, WELCOME TO TARA, OUR TOWN BOARD, UH, WORK SESSION.
UM, THE FIRST, UM, JUST APOLOGIZE FOR THE, FIRST OF ALL, WE APOLOGIZE FOR, UH, THE DELAYS DUE TO TECHNICAL DIFFICULTIES.
AND, UM, I GUESS THE FIRST ITEM IS A PRESENTATION FROM SUSTAINABLE WESTCHESTER.
SO DO WE HAVE THEM? DAN IS HERE.
DO WE NEED TO TURN THIS OFF? BECAUSE, HI EVERYBODY.
WE'LL, WE'LL PROMOTE THE ONES THAT NEED, BECAUSE HOW'S IT GOING? AND MAYBE YOU COULD TELL US EXACT, YOU KNOW, WHAT YOUR, UH, MEETING US ABOUT.
UM, SO WE ARE IN THE PROCESS NOW OF, UM, WORKING WITH ALL THE MUNICIPALITIES TO COME TOGETHER AROUND THE NEXT, UH, CONTRACTING ACTIVITIES.
AND, UM, WE, UH, HAVE IN, IN PLACE A PROGRAM FOR THE YEAR, WHICH, UH, ACTUALLY I HAVE A, A PRESENTATION TO GO THROUGH AND KIND OF LAY IT ALL OUT, BUT IT WOULD CALL FOR AN EXTENSION TO OUR CURRENT CONTRACT FIRST, FOLLOWED BY, UH, A NEW AUCTION LATER IN THE YEAR.
UH, BUT THEY'RE AS USUAL, THERE ARE, YOU KNOW, VERY, UM, UNYIELDING SORT OF SCHEDULE MILESTONES AND THINGS THAT WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH.
AND, AND DOING THAT WITH 24 MUNICIPALITIES, UH, CAN BE, UH, QUITE A, A, A BALLET SESSION.
SO I'D LIKE TO, IF I COULD GO THROUGH AND, UH, KIND OF EXPLAIN, UM, YOU KNOW, WHERE, WHERE WE'RE GOING WITH THINGS AND WHAT THE PROPOSAL IS, UH, IN TERMS OF THE, THE NEXT ACTION.
SO I'LL GO AHEAD AND SHARE THIS AND I'LL SKIP THROUGH, UH, QUICKLY THE SORT OF, YOU KNOW, UH, BASICS PROGRAM BASICS.
YOU CAN ALL SEE MY, MY SCREEN ON YOUR YES.
SO, UH, RIGHT, YOU KNOW, US SUSTAINABLE WESTCHESTER, WE'RE THE, UH, SHARED SERVICE FOR SUSTAINABILITY MEASURES FOR MUNICIPALITIES.
AND WE'RE TALKING TODAY ABOUT THE, THE WESTCHESTER POWER PROGRAM, UH, WORKED WITH 29 MUNICIPALITIES WITH, UH, YONKERS AND TUCKAHOE, UM, THE PAST YEAR.
IT IS YOUR COMMUNITY ENERGY PROGRAM.
IT'S A COLLECTIVE, UH, UH, ELECTRICITY SUPPLY PROGRAM.
AND WITH, AS A GOAL OF DRIVING MORE, UH, RENEWABLE ENERGY UPTAKE, AND TO PROVIDE AN OPTION IN SOMEWHERE IN BETWEEN, JUST STICKING WITH THE UTILITY AND GOING OUT ON YOUR OWN AND TRYING TO DEAL WITH THE, THE PRIVATE ESCOS.
AND OF COURSE, BRINGING US ALL TOGETHER, UH, ALLOWS US TO BRING OUR LEVERAGE TO BEAR ON THE MARKET.
AND, UH, AGAIN, THIS IS REALLY THE, THE MAIN DRIVER IS TO TRY AND HELP, UH, ACCELERATE THE TRANSITION TO RENEWABLE ENERGY.
AND WE HAVE HAD QUITE A, AN IMPACT IN GREENBURG IS STARTING TO TAKE A CHUNK OUT OF THEIR FOOTPRINT WITH THIS AS WELL.
AND, AND THE CURRENT CONTRACT GOES THROUGH, UH, JUNE 30TH OF THIS YEAR.
AND, UH, I MAY BE AWARE THAT THE, THE CURRENT RATES ARE VERY FAVORABLE BECAUSE THEY WERE SIGNED BACK, THEY STARTED BACK IN JANUARY OF LAST YEAR, AND WE'RE ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, THE AUCTION WAS THEN AT THE END OF 2020.
AND THEY'RE 7 4 1, 7 0.41 CENTS FOR THE RENEWABLE SUPPLY AND 6.75 CENTS FOR THE STANDARD.
VERY IMPORTANT TO KNOW THAT WE ALWAYS HAVE THAT STANDARD SUPPLY THAT PEOPLE CAN OPT DOWN TO.
SO COMPARING TO CON ADD IS ALWAYS A MATTER OF, UH, TRYING TO, UH, COMPARE TO A VARIABLE, MONTH TO MONTH.
AND IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO ALSO TO, UH, UM, TO COME UP WITH A, A SYSTEMATIC WAY OF THINKING ABOUT THE FUTURE.
'CAUSE WE DON'T KNOW WHAT CONED RATE'S NECESSARILY GOING TO BE.
AND OF COURSE, CONED IS A, IS JUST A, A NORMAL GRID, MIXED SUPPLY OF FOSSIL FUELS.
UM, ONE, UH, OTHER KEY FEATURE ABOUT THE PROGRAM, IT'S CONSUMER FRIENDLY.
YOU CAN OPT OUT AT ANY TIME TO THINK OF YOUR RATE AS MORE OF A CAP RATHER THAN, UH, A FIXED, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE, YOU'RE STUCK IN IT.
UH, YOU'VE SEEN THIS GRAPH BEFORE.
IT'S ON THE, ON THE WEBSITE, YOU KNOW, THAT YOU SEE THAT SPIKE.
EVERYBODY HEARD ABOUT, UH, THE BIG JUMP IN IN PRICING.
YOU ALSO SEE THE, THE MARCH RATE IS COMING WAY DOWN.
THIS IS NOT A, A MATTER OF THE ACTUAL SORT OF ENERGY MARKET COMING DOWN, BUT, UH, CONED APPLIED A, UH, VERY SIGNIFICANT NEGATIVE ADJUSTMENT TO THEIR RATES.
THEY DO HAVE THESE ADJUSTMENT FACTORS THAT USUALLY GO BETWEEN 2 CENTS AND MINUS 2 CENTS IN ANY GIVEN MONTH, YOU KNOW, UH, BUT THIS ADJUSTMENT WAS OVER SUCCESS.
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SEEN THAT IN THE SIX YEARS OF OUR PROGRAM.SO IT'S BOUND TO BOUNCE BACK BECAUSE THE MARKETS ARE STILL UP.
THIS IS KIND OF A SIMPLISTIC WAY OF LOOKING AT HOW OUR, UH, PROGRAMS PERFORMED, IS THAT JUST TAKE THE, THE AVERAGE OF CONED RATES AND THE AVERAGE OF OUR RATE.
SO IF WE LOOK AT THAT AND THE, THE CURRENT CONTRACT FOR COMPARING RENEWABLE, UH, THE CUSTOMERS DID BETTER THAN CONED BY ABOUT 0.69 CENTS PER, PER KILOWATT HOUR, TWO THIRDS OF A CENT.
AND OF COURSE, IF YOU'RE IN THE STANDARD SUPPLY, YOU, YOU WERE DOING EVEN BETTER.
IF YOU LOOK LONGER BACK TO THE, TO THE LAUNCH, IT'S, UH, ABOUT YOU ARE IN A NEGATIVE 0.20 CENTS A FIFTH OF A CENT RELATIVE TO CONED IN THE RENEWABLE, AND YOU'RE JUST A, A BIT BETTER THAN BREAK, EVEN WITH THE STANDARD AND THE, AND THE RESIDENTIAL, JUST, UH, A WAY TO KIND OF BENCHMARK, UH, HOW THE RATES HAVE BEEN PERFORMED.
BUT AGAIN, PART OF THE VALUE IS IN THE, YOU KNOW, THE SPECIFIC NUMBERS, BUT PART IS ALSO IN THAT, IN THAT STABILITY.
SO IT DID CARRY US THROUGH THIS BIG SPIKE, AND PEOPLE WERE SHIELDED FROM THAT.
UM, VERY IMPORTANT PART OF THE CONTEXT, AS, AS I TAKE YOU UP TO, AGAIN, THE, THE, UM, THE ACTION ITEMS AND THE, AND THE PROPOSALS FOR THE CONTRACTING ACTIVITY IS THIS, UH, LONGER TERM PLAN FOR LATER IN THE YEAR WHERE, WHICH WE'RE CALLING WESTCHESTER POWER 2.0.
AND IT'S, UH, THE, THE, UM, ACTIVITY IS DESIGNED AROUND TRYING TO INCREASE THE AMOUNT OF, UH, BIDDERS THAT WE CAN BRING TO OUR AUCTIONS AND, AND, UH, ALSO BRING MORE FLEXIBILITY INTO THE WAY WE GO OUT AND DO PROCUREMENT.
UH, AND WITH THE AIM OF, FOR LONG TERM, HAVING, UH, MORE STABLE SUPPLIES AND ALSO BEING ABLE TO USE THIS, THIS FUNCTION, THIS KIND OF TOOL TO DRIVE MORE RENEWABLE ENERGY CONSTRUCTION DIRECTLY.
AND WHAT IS IT THAT WE'RE INTENDING TO DO? WELL, YOU LOOK AT WHAT WE DO NOW, IT ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, FORGET ALL THE BOXES UP THERE.
IT REALLY REDUCES TO PURCHASING THROUGH AN ESCO.
WE GO OUT INTO THE MARKET AND WE GO OUT FOR BIDS AND THE WINNING ESCO AS THE SUPPLIER TO THE RESIDENTS AND SMALL BUSINESSES IN OUR PROGRAM.
SO THE IDEA WOULD BE, RIGHT NOW THAT'S A, A LIMITED POOL.
IT'S CERTAIN FOLLOWED BY ESCOS.
AND WHAT WE WANNA DO IS INVITE WHOLESALE SUPPLIERS TO THE, TO THE AUCTION AS WELL.
WE'VE GOT A, A, A COMPANY WHICH IS ABLE TO TAKE A WHOLESALE BID, ADD THE, ALL THE DIFFERENT SERVICES.
THERE'S ANCILLARY SERVICES AND CAPACITY PURCHASING AND, AND SOME RETAIL FUNCTIONS TO WRAP THAT WHOLESALE BID SUCH THAT IT THEN BECOMES A QUALIFIED, UH, ESCO SUPPLY.
AND AGAIN, IN NEW YORK STATE, IF YOU'RE SUPPLYING A RETAIL CUSTOMER, YOU EITHER HAVE TO BE A UTILITY OR AN ESCO.
SO WHOLESALERS DON'T SUPPLY DIRECTLY TO THAT MARKET, AND IT'S NOT THE MARKET YOU'RE INTERESTED IN.
BUT BY DOING THIS, WE'LL BE ABLE TO RUN ON THE SAME DAY AN AUCTION WHERE WE BRING THE, UH, THE NORMAL, UH, RETAIL ESCOS THERE TO BID, BUT WE ALSO, UH, CALL ON THE, THE WHOLESALE SUPPLIERS TO BID.
AND WE CAN TAKE THOSE BIDS, ADD THEM TO THE KNOWN SLEEPING COSTS TO PA TO PACKAGE IT UP AS A, A FULL ESCO SUPPLY AND COMPARE IT TO THE, UH, THE, THE RETAIL BIDS.
AND, AND FROM THAT, WE HAVE MORE TO CHOOSE FROM.
AND IF THOSE BIDS END UP LOWER, THEN WE HAVE, UH, ADDED TO OUR, UH, TO OUR OPTIONS AND ARE, AND ARE ABLE TO GET A LOWER PRICE OUT OF THAT.
UM, AND AS I SAID, IT'S NOT ONLY ABOUT, UH, THAT AUCTION, BUT IT'S ABOUT LOOKING INTO THE FUTURE AS WELL, WHICH SEES US PERHAPS, UH, HAVING DIRECT, UH, BILATERAL CONTRACTS WITH, UM, DEVELOPERS WHO ARE PUTTING IN NEW RENEWABLE ENERGY FACILITIES.
SO THIS WOULD BE THE SAME KIND OF STRUCTURE WHERE WE'D HAVE TO WRAP THAT IN ALL THE SERVICES NEEDED TO ULTIMATELY YIELD A, UH, A RETAIL SUPPLY.
SO IT, UH, ENHANCES THE COMPETITION, UH, IN THIS IMMEDIATE AUCTION.
AND IT ALSO, UH, BUILDS TOOLS FOR US FOR THE FUTURE.
UM, SO IN ORDER TO GET THERE, WE ARE PROPOSING TO, UH, JUST RUN A, UH, JUST A EXTENSION TO THIS CONTRACT FIRST, GIVE OURSELVES A FEW MORE MONTHS AND, UH, TO PUSH OUT THIS ULTIMATELY ENHANCED AUCTION FOR LATER IN THE YEAR.
UM, 'CAUSE WE NEED TO PUT TOGETHER THOSE NEW RFPS, THAT SLEEPING ARRANGEMENT.
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AND AT THE SAME TIME, WE WANT TO USE THAT TIME TO BEAT THE BUSHES, TO BRING MORE SUPPLIERS IN BOTH, BOTH OF THESE NEW WHOLESALE SUPPLIERS AND ALSO THE RETAIL BIDDERS.THERE'S, UH, IN TERMS, IN TERMS OF, UH, THE, UH, THE SAVINGS, UM, YOU KNOW, FOR THE, DURING THE LIFE, UH, UH, I KNOW THERE WAS IN JANUARY, THERE WERE SAVINGS, UM, YOU KNOW, IN RECENT MONTHS, COULD YOU JUST GO, YOU KNOW, LET PEOPLE KNOW WHAT THE SAVINGS WERE? UM, YEAH, I CAN GO BACK.
UM, AND I DIDN'T PREPARE LIKE, UH, ALL KINDS OF NUMBERS ON THAT.
WE WERE TRYING TO, UH, STAY FOCUSED IN THIS.
BUT, UM, IF WE GO BACK TO THE, UH, THE ONE CHART I DID BRING, UM, LET ME SEE HERE.
I MEAN, AS I SAID, THIS JUST GIVES US, FROM THE START OF THE CONTRACT BACK TO THE SLIDESHOW MODE, UH, AND FROM, FROM THIS CURRENT CONTRACT.
SO YOU FIGURE, UM, WE CAN USE SOME, SOME BALLPARKS HERE.
FIRST OF ALL, DURING THAT BIG SPIKE, UH, IN JANUARY, RATES WENT UP TO 17 CENTS.
OUR, OUR WESTCHESTER POWER CUSTOMERS WERE LOCKED IN IF THEY WERE IN THE RENEWABLE SUPPLY AT, UH, 7.40 CENTS.
SO IT WAS NEARLY 10 CENTS A KILOWATT HOUR THAT THEY WERE PROTECTED FROM DURING THAT SPIKE.
AND IF THE AVERAGE, UM, CUSTOMER U USAGE OR, UH, KILOWATT HOURS FOR A MONTH IS ROUGHLY AROUND 600 KILOWATT HOURS, THEY COULD HAVE BEEN LOOKING AT A $60 SPIKE FOR THAT, FOR THAT MONTH.
SO, SO THAT'S KIND OF A MEASURE OF, OF THE PROTECTION.
NOW, YOU KNOW, RATES GO UP AND DOWN, SO WE COULD BE BEHIND, UH, CONED IN ANOTHER MONTH, BUT IT'S THAT THOSE EXTREMES WERE SHAVED OFF.
UH, THIS CHART JUST GIVES US, ON A LONGER TERM BASIS, AS I SAID, IF YOU'RE IN THE RENEWABLE SUPPLY DURING THIS CONTRACT, BUT YOU'RE GOING BACK TO, UH, JANUARY OF 2021, YOU'RE SAVING A LITTLE OVER TWO THIRDS CENTS, UM, PER, UH, PER KILOWATT HOUR.
AGAIN, THAT'S GONNA BE ABOUT, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE GONNA SAVE MAYBE ABOUT THREE OR $4 A BILL ON AVERAGE DURING THAT CONTRACT, UH, OVER THE LONG HAUL, BECAUSE WE DID HAVE THAT TOUGH CONTRACT, THE, THE, UH, PERIOD BEFORE YOUR NET NEGATIVE, UH, FIFTH OF A CENT.
UH, YOU KNOW, SO THAT'S A, A COUPLE OF DOLLARS ON, ON AVERAGE, PERHAPS.
UH, BUT THAT'S ALSO, UH, WITH THE RENEWABLE ENERGY, UH, WHICH IS NORMALLY AT A PREMIUM, WE KNOW THERE'S A, A PREMIUM BUILT INTO THAT.
SO FOR THAT FIFTH OF A CENT PER KILOWATT HOUR, WE'VE GOT THE RENEWABLE ENERGY PREMIUM PLUS THE, THE, UH, PROTECTION, THE KIND OF INSURANCE POLICY FROM THE SPIKES AND THE ABILITY TO, TO, OF COURSE, UH, IF, IF FOR SOME REASON OUR RATES START TO DEVIATE TOO MUCH, YOU ALWAYS HAVE THE FREEDOM TO, TO, UH, EXIT FROM THE PROGRAM AS WELL.
SO WE CAN
IT'S ON A PER KILOWATT HOUR BASIS.
SO AS I SAY, I CAN, YOU KNOW, JUST, UH, ROUGHLY SPEAKING, IT WAS A, A TYPICAL 600 KILOWATT HOUR A MONTH BILL AT, UM, YOU KNOW, A PENNY WOULD BE $6, TWO THIRDS OF A PENNY.
SO YOU'RE SAVING ABOUT $4 A MONTH OVER THE COURSE OF, THIS HAS BEEN SINCE WE STARTED.
NOW ABOUT, UM, THIS IS THROUGH, UH, THROUGH FEBRUARY.
UM, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT 1248, LITTLE OVER $50 IN SAVINGS DURING THE COURSE OF THIS OKAY.
SO, SO REALLY THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT AT THE BY PARTICIPANT, THE TOWN PARTICIPATED IN THIS ALONG WITH 29 OTHER COMMUNITIES, AND THE AVERAGE PERSON SAVED SOMETHING DURING THE LIFE OF THE CONTRACT.
IT DIDN'T COST ANYBODY, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE DIDN'T COME OUT BEHIND, THEY CAME OUT AHEAD DURING THE LIFE OF THE CONTRACT DURING THIS CONTRACT.
AND THE, AND THE PREVIOUS CONTRACT, THE SAME THING HAPPENED.
WELL, THE PRE PREVIOUS CONTRACT NUMBER, WHEN WE HAD CONTRACT TWO, WE WERE IN THE RED CONTRACT ONE.
WE WERE, WE WERE POSITIVE THEN.
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SO, UH, THAT'S WHY WE HAVE ALSO THE, SINCE LAUNCH NUMBERS HERE, WHICH ARE CLOSE TO BREAK EVEN ON THE RENEWABLE SIDE, YOU ARE NEGATIVE BY A FIFTH OF A CENT.UM, ON THE, ON THE STANDARD SUPPLY, IF YOU WERE IN THE, THE REGULAR GRID SUPPLY, YOU WERE UP BY, UM, POINT, 0.14 CENT.
SO IT'S, IT'S PRETTY, IT HUGES PRETTY CLOSE TO WHERE THE MARKET HAS BEEN OVER THE LONG TERM.
BUT IN THE, DURING THIS CURRENT CONTRACT, WE'VE, WE'VE COME OUT CLEARLY AHEAD AND AGAIN, WE'VE BEEN PROTECTED FROM THE, THE WILD GYRATIONS THAT ARE THERE, WHICH CAN BE VERY PAINFUL FOR PEOPLE AT TIMES.
SO THERE'S ALSO THE VALUE IN THE STABILITY, IF I, SO, SO ANY THOUGHTS FROM THE BOARD? WHAT I THINK I WOULD, I THINK FOR ME, IT WOULD BE EASIER IF WE WOULD'VE SAW ON A GRAPH INSTEAD OF SEEING IN A CHART LIKE THAT.
SO WE CAN SEE WHERE THE, HOW THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THE, WITHIN THE DIFFERENT MONTHS OF THE YEAR.
SO IF YOU HAD A GRAPH, IF YOU HAD A GRAPH, I KNOW YOU WEREN'T PREPARED TO TALK ABOUT, UH, IS THIS, IS THIS THE GRAPH? WELL, THIS WOULD BE THE GRAPH OF THE RAW RATES, YES.
WHICH IS PRETTY, PRETTY ILLUSTRATIVE.
SO THIS IS WHERE WE CAN SEE IN THIS CURRENT CONTRACT, WE'RE NETTING OUT AHEAD, THIS CONTRACT WAS A TOUGH ONE.
RIGHT AFTER WE SIGNED THE CONTRACT, THE BOTTOM FELL OUT OF THE, THE NATURAL GAS MARKET, WHICH IS, WHICH IS WHERE ELECTRIC PRICES, ELECTRICITY PRICES ARE, ARE BASED OUT OF REALLY THE NATURAL GAS MARKET DRIVES THEM.
AND IN THE FIRST CONTRACT, AGAIN, WE WERE NET POSITIVE.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S KIND OF, AND YOU KNOW, AND YOU CAN SEE, UH, THESE, THE YELLOW LINE IS OUR STANDARD RATE AND THE, UM, I THINK IT'S GREEN.
I'M A LITTLE BIT, UH, COLORABLE THE LINE ABOVE IT AS THE, AS THE RENEWABLE LINE.
AND YOU CAN KIND OF SENSE THE, YOU KNOW, THE, THE STABILITY THERE VERSUS, VERSUS THE GYRATIONS FROM MONTH TO MONTH THAT, UM, SOME PEOPLE TRYING TO FIGURE THINGS OUT.
SO THE YELLOW LINE IS HARD TO SEE.
SO I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE NEXT TIME DO A DIFFERENT COLOR.
IT'S A LITTLE HARD TO DETERMINE.
MAYBE IF I CHANGE THE SCALE A BIT, UH, LET IT STRETCH OUT A LITTLE BIT, I CAN, I CAN GET THAT MORE DISTINCT THERE.
UM, BUT THEY'RE, THEY'RE PRETTY CLOSE.
SO IT'S NOT
'CAUSE I, I THINK YOU MIGHT WANT TO IN THE CONTEXT OF, OF THE REST OF, OF WHAT I'M ABOUT TO SAY.
SO AS I SAID, WE, WE ARE PLANNING TO TRY AND ENHANCE THE, THE PROCUREMENT SYSTEM IN ORDER TO, TO BRING IN MORE COMPETITION.
UH, AGAIN, WHAT THIS MEANS IS THAT ON THE SAME, SAME DAY WE'LL HAVE AN OPTION BOTH FOR THE RETAIL SUPPLIERS AND FOR THE WHOLESALE SUPPLIERS, AND BE ABLE TO HAVE MORE OPTIONS TO CHOOSE FROM, MORE COMPETITION AND, UH, AGAIN, NEW TOOLS FOR THE FUTURE AS WELL.
SO, UH, AND AS I SAID, OUR, WHAT WE'RE LOOKING TO DO IN ORDER TO ACHIEVE THAT IS TO, UH, UH, ENGAGE IN A, A SHORT-TERM EXTENSION FIRST.
AND THAT, UM, UH, EXTENSION IS NOT ONLY FOR TO PROVIDE TIME TO PUT THAT TOGETHER, BUT IT'S ALSO ADVISED TO US, UH, BY TRANSPARENT ENERGY IN TERMS OF IF WE WERE TO GO OUT RIGHT NOW FOR, FOR THE TYPICAL LONG-TERM CONTRACT, THERE WOULD BE A LOT OF UNCERTAINTY PRICED INTO THAT CONTRACT 'CAUSE OF EVERYTHING THAT'S GOING ON, YOU KNOW, TRAGEDIES OVERSEAS IS FURTHER DRIVING, UH, THE, THE GAS MARKETS AND THE, THE UNDERLYING, UH, PRICING.
SO RIGHT NOW, WE'RE LOOKING AT, WITH THAT EXTENSION, UH, WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND THAT THOSE, THOSE PRICES BE NOTHING LIKE WHAT WE HAVE, UH, IN OUR CURRENT CONTRACT TODAY.
UM, BECAUSE THAT WAS A DIFFERENT WORLD BACK THEN, YOU KNOW, AND TODAY EVERYTHING IS MOVED UP, UM, QUITE, QUITE HIGH.
UM, SO, SO AS I SAID, THIS IS WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IN TERMS OF THE, THE EXTENSION SCHEDULE.
UM, WE'RE LOOKING AT THE END OF OUR CURRENT CONTRACT BEING AT THE END OF JUNE.
YOU BACK AWAY FROM THAT, YOU'VE GOT THE OPTOUT PERIOD, THE 30 DAY OPTOUT PERIOD, AND, UH, YOU KNOW, THERE'S THE PREP BEFORE THAT.
WE NEED TO GET TO, UH, EXECUTION OF A NEW CONTRACT SOMETIME IN MID, MID-APRIL.
REALLY, IN ORDER TO PULL ALL THIS SCHEDULE UP, IT'S, IT'S QUITE TIGHT.
THAT SETS US UP FOR THE SECOND HALF OF THE YEAR, WHICH AFTER A A FIVE MONTH, UH, UM, EXTENSION, UH, WE'RE LOOKING AT A DECEMBER 1ST START.
AND AGAIN, BACKING AWAY FROM THAT, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT AN AUCTION IN, UH, AUGUST AND
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THE PREP WORK THAT COMES BEFORE THAT.BUT THE, AS I SAY, THE, THE CURRENT ACTION IS LOOKING TO GET THE MOUS SIGNED OFF, UH, FOR MUNICIPALITIES THAT, UH, WANT TO CONTINUE THEIR PARTICIPATION ARE, ARE ALL THE COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE BEEN PARTICIPATING, UH, STICKING WITH THE PROGRAM.
WE HAD, UH, THREE MEETINGS LAST NIGHT, AND I HAVEN'T HEARD BACK FROM ALL OF 'EM EXCEPT ONE NOW.
KISCO, UH, SENT US THEIR M O U ALREADY.
UH, WE'RE, WE'RE JUST DOING THE ROUNDS NOW, UH, WITH ALL THE MUNICIPALITIES, UH, IN TERMS OF GETTING THEM SIGNED OFF.
UM, SO FAR IT HAS BEEN VERY POSITIVE, BUT, UH, IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S NEVER, NEVER EASY TO, TO GET EVERYBODY ALL LINED UP LIKE THAT.
WHAT, WHAT IS THE, YOU KNOW, WHAT IS GOING TO BE THE RATE DURING THE EXTENSION? SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHERE I'M, I'M TAKING EVERYBODY.
NEXT IS THE, WHERE THE RATE WILL BE.
AGAIN, IT'S BEING DRIVEN BY THE, THE NATURAL GAS PRICES, WHICH HAVE DOUBLED SINCE THE TIME OF OUR LAST CONTRACT.
THAT IN A VERY, VERY CRUDE TERMS, UH, THAT ENERGY BEING ABOUT HALF OF THE, THE RETAIL PRICE MEANS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A 10 CENT, ROUGHLY AREA THAT, THAT ALL PRICES HAVE MOVED UP TO IN VERY ROUGH TERMS. UM, AND THAT, THAT PRESSURE ON THE GAS PRICES IS BEING DRIVEN BY EXPORTS, RECORD EXPORTS LAST YEAR.
AND NOW, OF COURSE, THE, THE NEWS THAT WE ARE GONNA BE SUPPORTING EUROPEAN, UH, CONSUMPTION AT AN EVEN, EVEN HIGHER LEVEL, UH, IN, IN THIS CURRENT YIELD.
UM, THERE'S ALSO THE MOVEMENT ON THE, THE REC PRICES.
NOW THE RENEWABLE ENERGY IS PURCHASED THROUGH THE MECHANISM OF THE RENEWABLE ENERGY CERTIFICATES THROUGH THE NEW YORK STATE GENERAL ASSET TRACKING SYSTEM SYSTEM.
AND IN OUR CURRENT CONTRACT, THOSE ARE SET AT ABOUT 0.60 CENTS PER KILOWATT HOUR.
UM, IN OUR LATEST CONTRACTS ON THE NYSEG AND YONKERS SIDE, THEY'RE UP AT 1.50 CENTS PER KILOWATT HOUR, AND THEY'RE EVEN NUDGED A LITTLE HIGHER.
UH, I'VE GOT 1.82 HERE, BUT THEY, THEY DROPPED BACK TO 1.72 IN THE LAST INDICATIVES.
UH, BUT IT'S JUST TO SAY THAT THAT'S PART OF THE DRIVER AS WELL.
SOME OF THAT IS JUST, IS JUST DEMAND.
UH, THE, THE SIMILAR COMMUNITY ENERGY ORGANIZATIONS AROUND THE STATE ARE ALSO, UH, DRIVING SOME OF THAT, BUT IT'S ALSO BEING DRIVEN BY THE STATE ITSELF, WHICH HAS ACTUALLY HELD AUCTIONS TO KIND OF PROP THAT PRICE UP.
THEY'RE TRYING TO KEEP THOSE LEGACY FACILITIES, UH, WORKING AT FULL CAPACITY NUMBER ONE, AND TO KEEP THEM FROM SELLING OUT INTO OTHER STATES, IN WHICH CASE WE, WE SORT OF LOSE THE CREDITS.
UM, THIS IS JUST A PEEK AT WHAT'S OUT THERE ON, IN THE ESCO WORLD FOR RENEWABLE ENERGY RIGHT NOW.
UH, THIS IS, UH, WE'VE GOT SIX MONTHS TERMS, 12 MONTHS TERMS. THEY'RE ALL COMING IN AROUND 13 CENTS AT THIS POINT.
AND THIS IS FROM THE NEW YORK STATE POWER TO CHOOSE WEBSITE.
SOMETIMES THE DATA THERE CAN BE STALE.
SO WE, WE POPPED OVER TO ONE OF THE, UH, LEADERS SITES OF VERDE ENERGY.
IT'S ALSO IN THE, IN THE THIRTEENS.
AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE GETTING NUMBERS LIKE THIS.
SO THIS IS THE INDICATIVE PRICING THAT WE'VE BEEN, UH, BRINGING IN WEEK, WEEK AFTER WEEK.
AND YOU'LL SEE IT'S BEEN, UH, INCREASING STEADILY.
AND PRIOR TO THE, YOU KNOW, THE, UH, LAST WEEK WE HELD, UH, THE CHIEF ELECTIVES AND ADMINISTRATORS MEETING.
WE BROUGHT EVERYBODY TOGETHER AND BROUGHT THIS, THIS DATA TOGETHER AND JUST TO LAY OUT FOR THEM WHAT WE THOUGHT THE, THE, THE, UM, TARGET PRICE FOR THE M O U SHOULD BE.
AND, UM, SO AT THAT TIME, THOSE ARE THE NUMBERS IN YELLOW.
WE'VE GOT ONE MORE ROUND THAT CAME IN AFTER THAT NOW, BUT AT THAT TIME, WE WERE TOTALING FOR THE RENEWABLE ENERGY AT ABOUT 11.76 CENTS.
AND SO WE SAID WITH THIS TREND, UM, THAT, YOU KNOW, WE SHOULD LEAVE A LITTLE BIT OF SPACE, AND WE WERE PROPOSING 12.50 CENTS FOR THE, FOR THE NOT TO EXCEED TARGET THAT LEFT, UH, A BUFFER, UH, THAT WAS IN THE RANGE OF WHAT WE'VE BEEN SEEING FOR THE, THE MOVEMENTS.
BECAUSE WE KNEW THAT FROM OUR EXPERIENCE WITH NYSEG, IF WE WERE TO SNUG RIGHT UP TO WHATEVER THE CURRENT INDICATIVE WAS, AND IT, AND IT MOVED ON US, THAT WE COULD MISS AND END UP IN A POSITION WHERE WE, UH, WERE, WERE NOT ABLE TO GO FORWARD WITH THE M O U AND WE HAD TO MAKE A WHOLE OTHER
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ROUND IN FRONT OF THE, THE BOARDS AGAIN, TO, TO ADJUST THE M O U, WE ENDED UP MISSING THE RENEWAL SCHEDULE, WHICH MEANT WE PUT THE WHOLE PROGRAM ON A PAUSE IN THE NICE TERRITORY FOR THREE MONTHS.IT'S JUST GETTING RESTARTED AGAIN IN MARCH WITH THAT.
SO WE LEFT A LITTLE BUFFER FOR THAT.
UH, AND ACTUALLY, UH, YOU CAN SEE WITH, UH, SINCE THIS HAS, SINCE THIS PRICE WAS ESTABLISHED, WE'RE NOW, WE'VE MOVED AGAIN.
WE'RE NOW IT'S ALREADY UP TO 12.03 CENTS.
UH, SO IT IS, IT IS CONTINUING TO MOVE, AND WE'RE A LITTLE BIT NERVOUS ABOUT THAT.
BUT AGAIN, THE, THE POINT OF HAVING SOME KIND OF A BUFFER WAS TO AVOID, UH, A TOTAL, UM, GAP IN THE, IN THE PROGRAM AND DROPPING OUT AND, AND, UH, CREATING A LOT OF CONFUSION AROUND, UH, THE, YOU KNOW, THE PEOPLE DROPPING OUT AND THEN HAVING TO COME BACK IN AGAIN AND ALL THAT.
UH, AND WE DID FIND, AND I SAY THAT, THAT THIS WAS HAPPENING JUST IN THE MIDDLE OF, UH, YOU KNOW, HIGH RATES AND ALL THAT.
AND, AND WE ACTUALLY HAD A SIGNIFICANT FEEDBACK OF SORT OF SENSE OF LIKE, WHERE, WHERE DID WESTCHESTER POWER GO WHEN WE NEEDED YOU? YOU KNOW? SO THERE'S, UM, UH, A VALUE IN TRYING TO KEEP THAT CONTINUITY AND THE STABILITY.
YOU STILL HAVE THE, THE, THE ABILITY TO TREAT THE RATE AS A, AS A CAP.
IF, UH, IF THE RATES START GOING IN ANOTHER DIRECTION AND YOU FEEL YOU WANT TO GET OUT, YOU CAN ALWAYS DO THAT.
AND OF COURSE, WE ALWAYS HAVE, AND WE ENCOURAGE PEOPLE WHO FEEL THAT THE STANDARD, UH, UH, RATE STANDARD SUPPLIES WHERE THEY NEED TO BE, UH, TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT.
BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, PROVIDING SOME KIND OF, UH, CONTINUITY TO THE PROGRAM, UH, KEEPS THAT STABLE RATE AND THAT THAT ADDITIONAL OPTION AVAILABLE TO PEOPLE AND OF COURSE CONTINUES THE, UM, TO BRING THE, THE RENEWABLE ENERGY SUPPLY.
WE HAVE A TIGHT AGENDA, YOU KNOW, TODAY.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS FROM THE BOARD TO LOOK SOBER MORE CAREFULLY? WELL, ONE, ONE THING THAT I, I, I WOULD APPRECIATE AS, 'CAUSE OBVIOUSLY WE NEED TO MOVE MORE AND MORE TOWARDS RENEWABLE, EVEN ON OUR OWN PROPERTIES.
AND SO I WOULD HOPE WHAT SUSTAINABLE WESTCHESTER WOULD, WOULD HELP THE TOWN WITH IS, UH, MANY OF US GET INUNDATED BY PEOPLE KNOCKING ON THE DOOR WANTING TO PUT UP SOLAR PANELS.
IT'S EXTREMELY CONFUSING, UM, WHETHER YOU KNOW, WHAT THE EFFICIENCY OF DIFFERENT SOLAR PANELS ARE, WHETHER OR NOT IT'S BETTER TO BUY OR TO HAVE THEM JUST RENT YOUR RENT, YOUR USE.
AND, AND ONE OF THE WAYS OF KEEPING DOWN ELECTRIC COSTS, OBVIOUSLY, IS FOR THOSE WHO CAN AS TO DO SOLAR.
AND, YOU KNOW, I I I THINK WE NEED TO BE MORE AGGRESSIVE IN HELPING THE CONSUMER TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THESE DIFFERENT OPTIONS ARE AND WHAT ARE THE BENEFITS OF THEM, WHETHER OR NOT THE PRODUCTS THAT YOU PROPOSE ARE, ARE BETTER AND WHY, AND OR NOT.
YOU KNOW, BASICALLY HAVE SOME KIND OF A SOMEWHAT INDEPENDENT ANALYSIS OF ALL OF THESE PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, PUTTING DOOR HANGERS AND KNOCKING ON DOORS AND, AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
I THINK THAT'S A GREAT, UH, GREAT POINT, FRANCIS.
BUT WHAT COMES TO MIND IS MAYBE WHAT WE SHOULD BE DOING IS PUT TOGETHER LIKE A ONE PAGER BUYER'S GUIDE, WHICH AT LEAST PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW.
YOU KNOW, FOR EXAMPLE, YOU WANT TO CHECK THAT THEY'RE ON, THAT THE, THE SUPPLIER OR THE, THE INSTALLER IS ON THE NYSERDA, UH, LIST, BECAUSE THAT, THAT ENSURES A CERTAIN LEVEL OF AUDITING THEIR PROJECTS.
UH, YOU WANNA KNOW HOW TO COMPARE OFFERS, YOU KNOW, A KILOWATT HOUR BASIS AND THIS AND THAT AND DIFFERENT THINGS.
SO THERE'S SOME BASICS THAT WE COULD PROBABLY PROVIDE A, A, A HANDY, YOU KNOW, SHEET FOR PEOPLE TO, TO DEAL WITH THESE THINGS AND ALSO HELP THEM DISTINGUISH, YOU KNOW, UH, UH, I'M GLAD YOU BROUGHT IT UP BECAUSE AGAIN, UM, THESE PROGRAMS ARE, UH, COMPLIMENTARY.
YOU CAN BE IN THE, UH, WESTERN POWER SUPPLY AND STILL BENEFIT FROM SOLAR.
UH, IF YOU HAVE SOLAR ON YOUR OWN HOUSE, THAT MEANS THAT YOUR TOTAL USAGE IS GOING DOWN AND ON THE NET.
AND THEN YOU, IN TERMS OF, UH, THE, THE PROGRAM PARTICIPATION THAT ONLY HAS TO DO WITH WHAT'S REMAINING, ESSENTIALLY.
RIGHT? OR IF YOU HAPPEN TO BE IN THE COMMUNITY SOLAR PROGRAM, UH, THOSE COME THROUGH AS MONETARY CREDITS.
[00:30:01]
A TOTALLY DIFFERENT TRACK FROM YOUR SUPPLY.SO WE COULD REALLY HAVE A KIND OF A ONE PAGE CONSUMER SHEET WHICH SORTS THAT STUFF OUT FOR PEOPLE AND GETS SOME RESOURCES FOR THAT.
SO I, I THINK THAT'S A, A, A GOOD PROMPT FOR ME THERE, FOR SURE.
AND MY, MY, MY OTHER BASICALLY STATEMENT IS THIS IS PROBABLY, I CAN'T THINK OF A WORST TIME TO WANT TO HAVE TO, I GUESS, 'CAUSE THE CONTRACT'S UP TO NEGOTIATE, UH, UM, ENERGY PRICES IN THE MIDDLE OF RUSSIA'S WAR WITH UKRAINE, YOU KNOW? RIGHT.
AND THE SANCTIONS THAT ARE BEING PLACED, UH, DESERVEDLY SO ON IT, AND, YOU KNOW, WHAT LENGTH OF CONTRACT ARE YOU LOOKING FOR? BECAUSE I, I FEEL LIKE WE'RE IN AN UNNATURAL SITUATION, RIGHT? WELL, IT'S CERTAINLY UNNATURAL, BUT IT'S, WE'RE IN AN UNUSUAL SITUATION RIGHT NOW, UH, BECAUSE OF THE WORLD OF EVENTS.
AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE SAYING, UH, SHORT TERM IS ACTUALLY A BETTER WAY TO GO TODAY BECAUSE IT'S JUST, YOU KNOW, THERE IS NO PROJECTING ON THE LONG TERM.
AND IF YOU ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, YOU LOOK AT THE, THE PRICES THAT WE WERE LOOKING AT A MOMENT AGO, UM, WE DO HAVE THE POP THIS BACK OUT AND WE DO HAVE THE, THE PRICES FOR THE LONGER TERM, EVEN THOUGH WE DON'T INTEND TO, TO GO THERE.
BUT IF, IF YOU LOOK OUT AT 12 MONTHS, ALL OF A SUDDEN PRICES POP UP, YOU KNOW, ANOTHER COUPLE OF CENTS.
AND THAT'S BECAUSE OF THIS UNCERTAINTY.
SO, SO YEAH, WE'RE, WE'RE TALKING LESS THAN, LESS THAN SIX MONTHS RIGHT NOW.
FIVE MONTHS LOOKS LIKE A SWEET SPOT FOR, FOR THIS.
AND, UM, THE, WHICH SHOULD ALSO BE NOTED THAT, UM, YOU KNOW, WE'RE, WE'RE STARING, UH, YOU KNOW, HIGHER PRICES FOR THIS PERIOD.
UM, AND, BUT THE SAME CAVEAT APPLIES NOW AS, AS SORT OF EVER DID.
WE DON'T KNOW WHAT CON ED PRICES ARE GONNA BE.
UM, THEY COULD BE HIGHER, THEY COULD BE LOWER.
NOT BEING IN THE PROGRAM IS NOT A GUARANTEE OF, OF PAYING, UH, LOWER PRICES FOR SURE.
YOU KNOW, WE, WE JUST DON'T KNOW WHERE CONEX PRICES ARE GONNA BE IN THERE.
THEY'RE GOING TO BE SUBJECTED TO THESE SAME MARKET FORCES.
SO THAT'S, YOU KNOW, IT IS, IT IS A WEIRD TIME TO BE OUT, OUT DOING THIS, FOR SURE.
I'M SURE WE'LL HAVE MORE QUESTIONS.
SO, SO I'LL, I'LL LEAVE YOU WITH THAT THEN.
UM, AND, UH, WE'LL, WE'LL CHECK BACK IN WITH YOU, UH, AND ABOUT, UH, WHERE, WHERE YOU MIGHT STAND WITH THAT AND, UH, AND HOW WE CAN MOVE FORWARD ON THE SCHEDULE.
ALRIGHT, THANKS EVERYBODY FOR YOUR TIME NOW.
THE LEAF BLOWER, UH, LEGISLATION.
DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY THOUGHTS ON HOW WE, HOW YOU'D LIKE TO PROCEED? I MEAN, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT IT AND, YOU KNOW, THERE'S OPPOSITION TO BASICALLY EVERYTHING.
YEAH, PAUL, SO I'LL JUMP IN REALLY QUICK.
YOU KNOW, WE DO HAVE A LOCAL LAW OUT THERE THAT I SENT TO YOU IN THE BOARD ON MARCH 25TH.
IT BANS LEAF BLOWERS FOR COMMERCIAL OPERATORS.
THAT'S, UH, GAS LEAF BLOWERS AND IT LIMITS BLOWERS FOR RESIDENTIAL USERS.
UM, BASICALLY, UM, BEFORE 11 O'CLOCK AND AFTER, UH, SIX O'CLOCK OR IN SOME INSTANCES 5:00 PM AND PERHAPS WE CAN EXPLORE THAT AT A PUBLIC HEARING AND GET SOME INPUT AND THEN, YOU KNOW, MAKE CHANGES AS ARE NECESSARY.
I ACTUALLY LIKE THAT, UH, THAT SORT OF HYBRID MODEL OF, OF BANNING ALL GAS BLOWERS, BANNING GAS BLOWERS, AND THEN BANNING ALL BLOWERS BETWEEN CERTAIN HOURS OF THE DAY.
I THINK THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S AN INTERESTING HYBRID MODEL.
YOU MEAN WE WOULD BAN ALL BLOWERS, SAY FROM SAY, 12 TO FIVE, I'M JUST THROWING OUT SOMETHING MM-HMM.
AND THEN, UM, AND THEN MAYBE ELECTRIC BLOWER, AND THEN YOU WOULD SAY, NO GAS BLOWERS, NO GAS, BUT, AND THEN ALL BLOWERS BETWEEN X AND Y TIME OR IN EARLY IN THE MORNING AND LATE IN THE EVENING, OR, YOU KNOW, EARLY IN THE MORNING AND PROBABLY AROUND HAPPY HOUR DINNER TIME.
WOULD YOU BE ABLE TO, LIKE, WE ACKNOWLEDGE THAT IT DOESN'T ADDRESS THE, UM, THE HEALTH AND ENVIRONMENTAL CONCERNS, YOU KNOW, ARTICULATED BY THE, THE C A C, ALTHOUGH WE ACKNOWLEDGE THEM, BUT THERE MIGHT BE SOMETHING THAT WE CAN ADDRESS IN THE FUTURE, BUT THIS IS A FIRST STEP.
[00:35:01]
TO, YOU KNOW, WORK WITH, YOU KNOW, TIM AND JUST FINE TUNE IT AND WE COULD PUT SOMETHING ON THE AGENDA AND SCHEDULE A PUBLIC HEARING.I MEAN, EVERYBODY'S GONNA, HALF THE PEOPLE ARE GONNA BE ANGRY WITH IT.
IT'S NO MATTER WHAT'S, THAT'S THE WAY IT IS THOUGH.
WHEN DID YOU SEND THAT TIM? ON THE 25TH.
UH, I THINK THE CITATION MAY BE INCORRECT ON, IN THAT VERSION.
AND YOU KNOW, THIS WOULD BE LIKE A ONE YEAR, I THINK WE SHOULD DO IT FOR ONE YEAR.
UM, YOU KNOW, SO THIS WAY PEOPLE BASICALLY WILL, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, IT'S AN EDUCATION TO ME, THE IMPORTANT THING IS REALLY EDUCATING PEOPLE.
AND, AND BEING PREPARED TO TAKE THE ARROWS AND, YOU KNOW, IF HASTINGS, UM, IS COMING UP WITH SOMETHING THAT'S INTERESTING RIGHT NOW MM-HMM.
THAT WAS OUT OF TITLE, RIGHT? RIGHT.
SO IF WE GET A COMPLAINT FROM A P B A, WE'RE ON TAPE.
UM, SO NOW I GUESS, UM, WE JUST HAVE THE EXECUTIVE SESSION, RIGHT? RIGHT.
AND THEN WE'LL BE BACK AT SEVEN O'CLOCK SHARP FOR, UH, PRESENTATION BY A K R F REGARDING FOUR CORNERS IN EAST HARSDALE CORRIDOR.
SO WHATEVER WE'RE DOING IN EXECUTIVE SESSION, WE'RE GOING TO STOP AND BE OUT AT SEVEN O'CLOCK.
WHAT KIND YOU'RE MAKING THAT MOTION? I'M MAKING A MOTION.
SECOND, THE PURPOSE DISCUSSING PERSONNEL MATTERS INVOLVING SPECIFIC INDIVIDUALS AND TO SEEK LEGAL ADVICE ON VARIOUS MATTERS.
AND WE WILL BE COMING BACK AND WE WILL BE COMING BACK AT SEVEN O'CLOCK SHARP.
UM, AND, UH, IF ANYONE HAS ANY QUESTIONS OR, UH, REGARDING THE A K R OF PRESENTATION, UH, THEY CAN EMAIL THEM TO PUBLIC COMMENT@GREENBERGNY.COM, PUBLIC COMMENT@GREENBERGNY.COM.
FINER TOWN COUNCIL MEMBERS AND EVERYONE WHO IS TUNING IN TONIGHT.
I'M GARRETT DUQUE, PLANNING COMMISSIONER FOR THE TOWN OF GREENBURG.
I'M JOINED THIS EVENING BY THE TOWN'S CONSULTANT FOR THE FOUR CORNERS AND EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE CORRIDOR STUDIES, A K R F, WHO IN A FEW MINUTES WILL PRESENT TRAFFIC AND STORE PRESENT TRAFFIC AND STORMWATER AND FLOODING MITIGATION INFORMATION THAT THEY HAVE BEEN DILIGENTLY WORKING ON.
A K R F WILL DISCUSS HOW THESE STUDIES WILL ASSIST THE TOWN IN CONTINUING TO PLAN FOR VARIOUS GRANTS AND ASSIST THE TOWN IN CONTINUING TO PLAN FOR POTENTIAL REDEVELOPMENT AT FOUR CORNERS.
I'D LIKE TO START BY RECAPPING SEVERAL OF THE PLANNING STEPS TAKEN PRIOR, WHICH HAVE BROUGHT US TO THIS POINT FOLLOWING THE TOWN'S ADOPTION OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN IN 2016, COLLECTIVELY, RESIDENTS, THE TOWN BOARD AND TOWN STAFF WORKED TOGETHER AND IDENTIFIED THE FOUR CORNERS AREA AS A FOCAL POINT AND GATEWAY INTERSECTION IN THE COMMUNITY, AND RE-ENVISIONED WHAT FOUR CORNERS COULD BE THROUGH GRASSROOTS CIVIC ASSOCIATION AND RESIDENT MEETINGS AND MEETINGS WITH THE TOWN IN 2019.
AS A RESULT OF THIS VISIONING FOR FOUR CORNERS, THE TOWN BOARD ADOPTED WHAT IS KNOWN AS THE FOUR CORNERS REDEVELOPMENT PLAN.
THIS PLAN ARTICULATES THE CHALLENGES THAT PREVENT THE LAND USES AT FOUR CORNERS FROM BEING COHESIVE AND COLLECTIVELY SUCCESSFUL.
AND HIGHLIGHTS WHY THE CENTRAL AVENUE IMPACT MIXED USE IMPACT DISTRICT REGULATIONS PREVENT SIGNIFICANT PRIVATE INVESTMENT INTO THE AREA.
THE PLAN DESCRIBES WHAT A REDEVELOPED FOUR CORNERS COULD BE WITH APPROPRIATELY SCALED BUILDINGS, HIGH QUALITY ARCHITECTURAL COMPONENTS, ATTRACTIVE PLAZA AND POCKET PARK SPACES, AND BLENDED STRUCTURED PARKING.
HOWEVER, WHAT WE ALL RECOGNIZE IS
[00:40:01]
THAT THE TOWNS CANNOT SIMPLY REZONE THE AREA AND HAVE WHAT I JUST DESCRIBED PUT INTO PLACE AT FOUR CORNERS.WHAT IS NEEDED IS A PROFESSIONAL TECHNICAL AND COMPREHENSIVE REVIEW OF THE SURROUNDING INFRASTRUCTURE SYSTEM IN THE AREA A K R F HAS.
THROUGH THE PROACTIVE SUPPORT OF THE TOWN PERFORMED.
THESE ANALYSIS, WHICH WILL BE PRESENTED THIS EVENING TO ASSIST THE TECHNICAL ANALYSIS, OUTREACH, AND DISCUSSIONS OCCURRED WITH NEW YORK STATE D O T WESTCHESTER COUNTY PROPERTY OWNERS IN THE AREA, THE HARTSDALE PUBLIC PARKING DISTRICT, THE HARTSDALE FIRE DISTRICT, AND OTHERS.
WHAT I APPRECIATE MOST ABOUT THE LAND USE STEPS THAT ARE UNDERWAY FOR FOUR CORNERS AND EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE IS THAT WE ARE NOT TALKING ABOUT PLANNING IN TERMS OF ALL OR NOTHING.
MANY OF THE TRAFFIC SAFETY, PEDESTRIAN SAFETY, AND FLOOD MITIGATION INITIATIVES WE WILL HEAR ABOUT TONIGHT ARE VERY HELPFUL AND IMPORTANT, EVEN IF FOUR CORNERS IS NOT REDEVELOPED IN THE NEAR FUTURE OR EVER AS EXAMPLES, ACTIONS THAT ARE IMMINENT, SUCH AS THE HAWK SIGNAL AT CENTRAL AND LAWTON, AND VIDEO DETECTION UPGRADES BY NEW YORK STATE DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION AT THE INTER INTERSECTION OF FOUR CORNERS WILL ENHANCE SAFETY AND LESSENED TRAFFIC CONGESTION AND WILL IMPROVE QUALITY OF LIFE THIS YEAR, 2022 FOR RESIDENTS.
HOWEVER, THE SAME IMMINENT MITIGATIONS ARE THOSE IDENTIF AND THOSE IDENTIFIED BY A K F THAT CAN BE MADE IN THE FUTURE ARE DIRECTLY CONNECTED TO THE PROSPECT OF REDEVELOPMENT AT FOUR CORNERS, WHICH COULD LEAD TO TRANSFORMATIONAL IMPROVEMENTS TO THIS GATEWAY IN HARTSDALE AND MAJOR INVESTMENT IN THE TOWN.
FROM A STORMWATER FLOODING PERSPECTIVE, THE CONCEPT IS THE EXACT SAME.
A K R F STUDIES IDENTIFY MITIGATION STEPS THAT WILL BE USED AND WILL LEAD TO GRANT APPLICATIONS FOR PROJECTS THAT WILL BE BENEFICIAL FOR THE TOWN WITH OR WITHOUT REDEVELOPMENT.
IN TERMS OF FORMAT, THIS EVENING, A K R F WILL PRESENT AND WE WILL OPEN UP THE FLOOR TO TOWN BOARD QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS, AND THEN QUESTIONS FROM THE PUBLIC.
IF YOU ARE VIEWING AT HOME OR OTHER, OR, OR SOME OTHER PLACE AND YOU WOULD LIKE TO ASK A QUESTION, PLEASE EMAIL THAT QUESTION TO PUBLIC COMMENT@GREENBURGNY.COM.
WE WILL RESPOND LIVE TO HERE TONIGHT TO AS MANY QUESTIONS AS POSSIBLE.
TONIGHT, HOWEVER, DOES NOT CONCLUDE THE OUTREACH THAT WILL OCCUR WITH THE PUBLIC FOLLOWING THE MEETING.
ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS CAN BE SENT TO PLANNING@GREENBERGNY.COM, AND THERE ARE SEVERAL OTHER PLANNING STEPS THAT WILL INVOLVE PUBLIC INPUT AND INVOLVE PUBLIC HEARINGS ASSOCIATED WITH FOUR CORNERS.
IF THERE IS A CIVIC ASSOCIATION THAT WILL LIKE ME TO MEET WITH THEM AT THEIR MONTHLY MEETING TO DISCUSS FOUR CORNERS IN EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE FURTHER, PLEASE LET ME KNOW AND I'D BE HAPPY TO ATTEND.
YOU CAN REACH OUT TO ME BY EMAIL OR DIRECT AT MY PHONE LINE NINE EIGHT NINE ONE FIVE THREE TWO.
WHAT I'D LIKE TO DO NOW IS TURN IT OVER TO ELAINE DEW AND MICHAEL BEATTY OF A K R F TO BEGIN WITH THE TRANSPORTATION IN FOUR CORNERS PRESENTATION.
JUST A QUESTION, IF THE PUBLIC EMAILS PLANNING@GREENBERGNY.COM OR PUB, UM, PUBLIC COMMENT@GREENBERGANDY.COM, WILL YOU BE ABLE TO SEE THOSE BOTH? YES, INDEED.
UM, PLEASE LET ME KNOW WHEN YOU CAN SEE MY SCREEN AND IF IT'S IN PRESENTATION MODE.
UM, GOOD, GOOD, GOOD EVENING EVERYONE.
I'M, TONIGHT I'LL BE PRESENTING THE TRAFFIC AND TRANSPORTATION PORTIONS OF THE HARTSDALE FOUR CORNER STUDY.
UH, MY NAME IS ELAINE DO AND I'M A TECHNICAL DIRECTOR FOR A K R F.
UH, SO IN TERMS OF WHAT WE'LL GO THROUGH TODAY, WE'LL FIRST DISCUSS EXISTING CONDITIONS, AND THAT INCLUDES WHAT'S GOING ON AT FOUR CORNERS TODAY IN TERMS OF THE, UH, TRAFFIC AND ALSO PEDESTRIAN CONDITIONS.
WE'LL TALK THROUGH THE PLANNED IMPROVEMENTS THAT NEW YORK STATE D O T AND ALSO THE TOWN OF GREENBURG HAVE PLANNED FOR THE FOUR CORNERS AREA.
AND FINALLY, WE'LL DISCUSS THE FOUR CORNERS REDEVELOPMENT POTENTIAL WITH ALL OF THESE IMPROVEMENTS, UM, AND ALSO A REDEVELOPMENT, UH, AND AN INITIAL AND THEORETICAL REDEVELOPMENT SCENARIO.
SO THIS IS THE STUDY AREA WE'LL BE REVIEWING AND THAT WE, UH, THAT WE'LL TALK ABOUT TONIGHT, AND THAT A K F HAS REVIEWED FOR TRAFFIC.
UH, OUR MAIN STUDY, UH, STUDY LOCATION IS THE FOUR CORNERS INTERSECTION OF HARTSDALE AVENUE AND CENTRAL AVENUE.
AND THE REDEVELOPMENT PARCELS THAT WE'LL TALK ABOUT ARE THE NORTHWEST CORNER WITH, THAT'S THE FORMER DWAYNE REED SITE IN THE NORTHEAST CORNER THAT HAS THE DRYER GYRO, UH, RESTAURANT IN UNICO AND ALSO, UH, JAPANESE SUPERMARKET, UH, THE, THE SOUTHEAST CORNER WITH IHOP AND OTHER RESTAURANTS, UM, AND FITNESS EQUIPMENT, AND ALSO THE SOUTHWEST CORNER FROM DALE ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE
SO THE WAY WE STARTED THIS, UH, THIS PROJECT WAS WE DID A LOT OF
[00:45:01]
DATA COLLECTION AND WE COLLABORATED EXTENSIVELY WITH THE TOWN.SO WE, WE WERE OUT THERE OURSELVES IN FALL OF 2019 TO DO OBSERVATIONS AND TO ALSO COLLECT TRAFFIC DATA, UH, PEDESTRIAN DATA AT FOUR CORNERS IN, UH, IN JANUARY, 2021, WE DID A SITE VISIT WITH THE TOWN OF GREENBURG TO DO A SITE WALK OF THE EAST HARTSDALE CORRIDOR.
AND THAT INVOLVED WALKING DOWN THE CORRIDOR, OBSERVING VARIOUS CONDITIONS AND TALKING THROUGH, UH, THE DIFFERENT TRAFFIC SIGNALS ON THE CORRIDOR.
UH, WE ALSO LOOKED THROUGH THE DALE NEIGHBORS ASSOCIATION COMMENTS THAT WERE ISSUED TO THE TOWN.
WE COORDINATED EXTENSIVELY WITH THE GREENBURG POLICE DEPARTMENT, AND THROUGH ALL OF THIS, WE IDENTIFIED VARIOUS, UH, PEDESTRIAN AND TRAFFIC DEFICIENCIES, WHICH WE'LL DISCUSS.
SO IN ORDER TO DO TRAFFIC ANALYSIS, WE APPLY A SOFTWARE CALLED SYNCHRO 10.
UH, WE USE THIS AS THE STANDARD TRAFFIC ANALYSIS SOFTWARE THAT APPLIES A NATIONAL STANDARD CALLED THE HIGHWAY CAPACITY MANUAL.
AND THAT GIVES US, UH, BASED ON VARIOUS INPUTS, INCLUDING TRAFFIC VOLUMES, PEDESTRIAN VOLUMES, AND SIGNAL TIMINGS THAT GIVES US VARIOUS OUTPUTS SUCH AS DELAY AND LEVEL OF SERVICE.
SO A LEVEL OF SERVICE IS REALLY A MEASURE OF HOW WELL AN INTERSECTION OPERATES.
UM, IT'S KIND OF LIKE A SCHOOL GRADE WHERE A IS THE BEST AND F IS TERRIBLE, UH, LEVEL OF SERVICE A IS OPERATING LIKE FREE FLOW CONDITIONS, YOU'LL GENERALLY ARRIVE ON GREEN AND PASS THROUGH IMMEDIATELY.
CLEARLY, WE KNOW THAT, UH, FOUR CORNERS DOES NOT OPERATE THIS WAY TODAY.
RIGHT NOW, FOUR CORNERS IS OPERATING CLOSER TO, UM, A LEVEL OF SERVICE E WHICH IS, YOU KNOW, IT'S WHEN IT'S WHEN YOU'LL EXPERIENCE SOME TRAFFIC BACKUPS.
UH, YOU'LL EXPERIENCE CYCLE FAILURE, WHICH IS WHEN YOU'LL WAIT AT A TRAFFIC SIGNAL FOR OF CYCLE OR TWO TO PASS THROUGH THE INTERSECTION.
SO WE KNOW IT'S NOT OPERATING VERY WELL.
UM, THE, THE UNIQUE PARTS OF THIS INTERSECTION IS IT'S REALLY, THERE ARE A LOT OF PEDESTRIANS CROSSING HERE.
UM, IT'S ALSO SUBJECT TO VARIOUS METRO NORTH PEAK HOUR SURGES WITH THE TRAINS COMING IN AND A COMMUTERS COMING THROUGH THE INTERSECTION.
AND AS A RESULT, UH, WE DO SEE VARIOUS QUEUES AND A LOT OF DELAYS AT THE INTERSECTION.
SO IN THE EASTBOUND DIRECTION THAT'S WEST HARTSDALE, UH, THAT QUEUE WE'VE OBSERVED TO EXTEND PAST WASHINGTON AVENUE AND EVEN TO HILLCREST ROAD IN THE WESTBOUND DIRECTION, WHICH IS EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE.
WE'VE NOTED THAT THE QUEUE CAN EXTEND PAST WILSON STREET AND SOMETIMES EVEN TO COLUMBIA.
AND IN THE NORTHBOUND DIRECTION, UH, THE NORTHBOUND LEFT TURN QUEUE ACTUALLY SLOWS BACK PRETTY FAR, AND WE'VE EVEN SEEN IT SPILL BACK TO THE BP GAS STATION TO THE SOUTH.
UM, IN ADDITION TO THIS, WE'VE ALSO LOOKED AT VARIOUS, UH, SAFE, WE'VE LOOKED AT SAFETY AT THE INTERSECTION.
SO WE ANALYZED THE CRASH HISTORY AT, AT FOUR CORNERS.
UH, IN, IN DOING THAT, WE REVIEWED A THREE YEAR PERIOD OF CRASH DATA, WHICH WAS 2016 THROUGH 2018.
AND DURING THIS TIME, UM, 96 TOTAL CRASHES OCCURRED AT THE INTERSECTION, WHICH IS EQUIVALENT TO ABOUT 32 CRASHES A YEAR.
AND OUT OF ALL OF THESE CRASHES, UM, 9 31 INJURIES OCCURRED, INCLUDING EIGHT SERIOUS INJURIES.
WE NOTED THAT THE CRASHES WERE PRIMARILY REAR END AND LEFT TURN CRASHES AS WELL.
UM, AND THESE ARE PRIMARILY ATTRIBUTED TO THINGS LIKE DELAY.
SO ONE THING WE NOTED WAS THAT, UH, THE TRAFFIC CONDITIONS AND THE BACKUPS AT FOUR CORNERS COULD POTENTIALLY BE LEADING TO THESE, UH, SAFETY DEFICIENCIES.
UH, SO IN THAT, UM, THE INTERSECTION CRASH RATE WAS NINE TIMES THE STATEWIDE AVERAGE OF A SIMILAR INTERSECTION.
AND THE LEFT TURN CRASH RATE WAS ACTUALLY 15 TIMES THE STATEWIDE AVERAGE COMPARED TO, AGAIN, A SIMILAR INTERSECTION.
SO IN TERMS OF PEDESTRIANS, ONE THING WE DO HAVE TO NOTE IS THAT THERE IS AN EXCLUSIVE PEDESTRIAN PHASE THAT PEDESTRIANS WILL ACTUATE BY PRESSING A BUTTON AND THEN CROSSING.
SO AN EXCLUSIVE PEDESTRIAN PHASE IS WHEN ALL VEHICLES ARE STOPPED TO ALLOW PEDESTRIANS TO CROSS ANY CROSSWALK.
UM, SO IT'S DURING, ESPECIALLY DURING THE PEAK HOUR, BECAUSE THERE ARE SO MANY PEDESTRIANS AND SO MANY COMMUTERS AT THE INTERSECTION, UH, THIS EXCLUSIVE PEDESTRIAN PHASE IS ACTIVATED FOR MOST OF THE PEAK HOUR.
UM, SOME PEDESTRIANS WILL CROSS WITHOUT THE WALK SIGNAL, WHICH IS SOMETHING WE OBSERVED WHEN WE WERE ACTUALLY OUT THERE.
UM, BUT IT'S, UH, IT VARIES TRULY.
UM, AND THIS EXCLUSIVE PEDESTRIAN PHASE DOES TAKE UP TIME FROM THE INTERSECTION, AND IT, IT MAY BE, UM, IT'S SOMETHING THAT MAY BE DETRACTING FROM THE
[00:50:01]
TRAFFIC CONDITIONS.HOWEVER, UH, BASED ON OUR CONVERSATIONS WITH THE TOWN AS WELL AS NEW YORK STATE, D O T, UH, WE DO NOT RECOMMEND REMOVING THIS EXCLUSIVE PEDESTRIAN PHASE, PARTICULARLY BECAUSE WE WANT TO MAINTAIN A LEVEL OF PEDESTRIAN SAFETY HERE.
UM, IN ADDITION, WE ALSO NOTED VARIOUS CONDITIONS SUCH AS NARROW SIDEWALKS ALONG EAST HARTSDALE, WHICH YOU'LL SEE ON THE RIGHT HAND SIDE.
UM, THAT IS THE NORTH SIDE OF EAST EAST HARTSDALE.
AND ALTHOUGH IT'S COMPLIANT WITH, UH, A D A, IT'S STILL NARROW AND NOT WHAT WE WOULD WANT FOR A WALKABLE TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT.
UM, IN TERMS OF WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE, THERE IS NO SIDEWALK ALONG THE WEST SOUTH SIDE OF, UH, HARTSDALE AVENUE, UH, SOUTH SIDE, WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE.
AND BEYOND THAT, UM, ONE THING WE REALLY WANTED TO CONSIDER WAS THAT IN THE FALL AND WINTER OF 2019, UM, THIS AREA OF GREENBURG AS WELL AS, UH, DIFFERENT VARIOUS PARTS OF THE TOWN HAD EXPERIENCED, UH, PEDESTRIAN CRASHES.
SO THERE WERE FATAL PEDESTRIAN CRASHES AT LAWTON AVENUE AND CENTRAL AVENUE, UH, INTERSECTION JUST NORTH OF OUR SITE, UM, AND ALSO ALONG EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE WITHIN OUR SITE.
SO WE REALLY WANTED TO KEEP THAT AT THE FOREFRONT OF OUR MINDS WHEN WE WERE DOING THESE ANALYSES FOR PARKING.
UM, THERE IS, THERE, THERE'S, UH, PARKING IN THE FOUR CORNERS AREA.
THERE'S SOME ON STREET PARKING, BUT PARKING IS PRIMARILY PROVIDED ALONG SURFACE LOTS.
UM, AND THIS IS FOR EACH BUSINESS, UH, EACH BUSINESS AT THIS LOCATION, OR ALMOST EACH ONE HAS THEIR OWN, UH, HAS THEIR OWN PARKING LOT.
UM, AND I WON'T LIST ALL OF THESE SPACES, I'M SURE YOU CAN READ THE SLIDE, BUT THERE ARE, UM, THERE ARE A FEW HUNDRED SPACES AT THAT FOUR CORNERS, UM, THAT HOWEVER, THESE SPACES WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO SUPPORT A LEVEL OF GROWTH THAT THE TOWN WANTS TO SEE FOR FOUR CORNERS IN TERMS OF ACCESS MANAGEMENT.
UM, ACCESS MANAGEMENT IS HOW, IS HOW, UH, VARIOUS BUSINESSES AND LAND USES WILL CONNECT TO MAJOR ROADWAYS.
SO THAT'S REALLY DRIVEWAYS LEADING TO CENTRAL AVENUE IN THIS CASE.
UM, AS YOU CAN SEE ON THE RIGHT HAND SIDE, THE ORANGE MARKS INDICATE EACH DRIVEWAY THAT EXIT FROM THESE FOUR CORNERS PARCELS TO THE, THE EXISTING ROADWAY NETWORK.
UM, THERE ARE A LOT OF DRIVEWAYS, AND I THINK THIS TOTALS UP TO OVER 20 DRIVEWAYS FOR ALL THESE PARCELS.
AND EVEN SOME SITES, SOME BUSINESSES HAVE MULTIPLE DRIVEWAYS FOR ACCESS TO THEIR SITE.
UM, SO BECAUSE THERE ARE SO MANY DRIVEWAYS AND SO MANY DRIVEWAYS THAT ARE CLOSE TO THE INTERSECTION, UM, VEHICLES WILL EXPERIENCE FRICTION FROM THESE DRIVEWAYS THAT EXIT ONTO CENTRAL AVE AND HARTSDALE AVENUE, AND THAT CAN LEAD TO SAFETY DEFICIENCIES AS WELL AS TRAFFIC OPERATIONAL ISSUES.
UM, SO FROM THIS, WE'VE TALKED THROUGH THE TRAFFIC CONDITIONS AND THAT WE KNOW FOUR CORNERS DOES NOT OPERATE WELL TODAY.
WE'VE TALKED THROUGH SAFETY AND THAT THE OPERATIONS, THE TRAFFIC OPERATIONS OF FOUR CORNERS, UM, AND VARIOUS GEOMETRIC DEFICIENCIES COULD POTENTIALLY BE ATTRI, UH, UH, COULD POTENTIALLY BE CONTRIBUTING TO SAFETY ISSUES AT FOUR CORNERS.
WE'VE TALKED ABOUT PEDESTRIAN ISSUES, UH, PARKING AND ACCESS MANAGEMENT.
FROM ALL THIS, WE BUILD INTO, UH, PLANNED IMPROVEMENTS.
SO THESE ARE WHAT THE TOWN AND ALSO D O T WANT TO DO TO IMPROVE FOUR CORNERS, EVEN WITHOUT DEVELOPMENT IN THE AREA.
SO GARRETT HAD ALREADY MENTIONED, UH, NEW YORK STATE D O T HAS VARIOUS IMPROVEMENTS PLANNED FOR THIS AREA, WHICH INCLUDES SIGNAL TRAFFIC, SIGNAL UPGRADES.
UM, THEY'RE ADDING NEW DETECTION, WHICH WILL MAKE, WHICH WILL MAKE THE INTERSECTION OPERATION MORE RELIABLE.
WHEREAS, UH, WE UNDERSTAND THAT, UH, A FEW YEARS AGO, UM, THE WEST HARTSDALE LOOP HAS FAILED IN THE PAST, WHICH HAS LED TO BACKUPS AND VARIOUS TRAFFIC ISSUES.
SO WITH DETECTION UPGRADES, THIS IS LESS LIKELY TO HAPPEN.
UM, THERE ARE ALSO SIGNAGE IMPROVEMENTS FOR THE INTERSECTION, WHICH WILL MAKE IT EASIER FOR DRIVERS TO PASS THROUGH.
UM, THERE ARE ALSO VARIOUS PEDESTRIAN IMPROVEMENTS SUCH AS CURB EXTENSIONS AND FOR AMP IMPROVEMENTS THAT WILL BETTER ALLOW PEDESTRIANS TO TRAVEL TO AND FROM FOUR CORNERS.
AND IN ADDITION, NEW YORK STATE D O T IS PLANNING TO RELOCATE THE NORTHBOUND BEELINE BUS TO THE FAR SIDE OF CENTRAL AVENUE.
SO, UM, IF YOU SEE MY MOUSE, THE BUS STOP CURRENTLY IS RIGHT HERE AND NEW YORK STATE D O T PLANS TO RELOCATE IT NORTH TO HERE.
UM, IN ADDITION TO WHAT D O T HAS PLANNED, THE TOWN OF GREENBERG ALSO HAS, AS GARRETT MENTIONED EARLIER, A HAWK SIGNAL
[00:55:01]
PLANNED FOR LAWTON AVENUE.AND A HAWK SIGNAL IS A PEDESTRIAN, ALSO KNOWN AS THE PEDESTRIAN HYBRID BEACON.
UM, THIS IS A TRAFFIC SIGNAL THAT'S REALLY JUST FOR PEDESTRIANS.
SO PEDESTRIAN WOULD PUSH A PUSH BUTTON, IT WOULD CHANGE FROM GREEN TO RED AND STOP ALL TRAFFIC FOR PEOPLE TO CROSS.
AND THIS IS REALLY, THIS WOULD REALLY IMPROVE PEDESTRIAN SAFETY FOR THIS AREA.
UM, ADDITIONALLY, THE TOWN OF GREENBURG HAS SUBMITTED A, A TAP BRAND APPLICATION TO NEW YORK STATE D O T FOR, UH, ADAPTIVE TRAFFIC CONTROL SYSTEM, AND ALSO CAMERA DETECTION ALONG EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE PLUS FOUR CORNERS, AS WELL AS VARIOUS PEDESTRIAN IMPROVEMENTS FOR WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE AND EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE, UM, FOR ADOPTIVE TRAFFIC CONTROLS.
UH, THIS, THIS IS REALLY HOW WE SAY SMART SIGNALS.
THESE ARE SMARTER TRAFFIC SIGNALS THAT ADAPT TO REAL TIME TRAFFIC, AND THEY, UH, THEY'LL SHIFT TIME AND THEY'LL SERVE, THEY'LL BETTER SERVE TRAFFIC ALONG EAST DALE AVENUE AS WELL AS AT FOUR CORNERS.
SO IN ADDITION TO WHAT'S ALREADY BEEN PLANNED, WE LOOKED AT VARIOUS ADDITIONAL IMPROVEMENTS THAT WE CAN BUILD ON TO FURTHER UNLOCK DEVELOPMENT POTENTIAL AT FOUR CORNERS.
AND OUR MAIN IDEA WAS ADDING TURN LANES AT THE INTERSECTION.
SO IN THIS CASE, WE'D BE ADDING POCKET TURN LANES.
UH, WE'VE LOOKED AT POCKET TURN LANES AT ALONG CENTRAL AVENUE AND ALONG WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE.
SO, UH, AS YOU CAN SEE HERE IN THE SOUTHBOUND DIRECTION, THIS YELLOW ARROW, UM, THIS TURN POCKET WOULD BE WITHIN THE CENTRAL PARK AVENUE TURN, UH, PARKING LANE.
UM, AND THIS WOULD ALLOW VEHICLES TO BETTER TRAVEL SOUTHBOUND, IT WOULD IMPROVE SOUTHBOUND TRAFFIC CONDITIONS, UM, IN THE NORTHBOUND DIRECTION OF THIS LITTLE ARROW HERE.
UM, THIS TURN POCKET, AGAIN, WOULD IMPROVE NORTHBOUND TRAFFIC CONDITIONS AND IS LOCATED IN THE BUS STOP CURRENTLY THAT NEW YORK STATE D O T IS PROPOSING TO MOVE FROM THIS SIDE OF THE STREET TO THIS SIDE, UH, FOR WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE.
THIS IS SOMETHING THAT, UH, A DEVELOPER WOULD NEED TO INCLUDE AS PART OF THEIR DEVELOPMENT OF THIS PARCEL HERE, THE DALE PARCEL.
UM, BUT ADDING AN EASTBOUND RIGHT TURN LANE FROM WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE TO CENTRAL AVENUE WOULD REALLY ALLOW VEHICLES TO TRAVEL BETTER ALONG WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE, UH, WHICH DOES BACK UP VERY FAR TODAY.
UM, MS. DOE CAN EAST CAN YOU, CAN YOU JUST DEFINE WHAT A POCKET TURN LANE IS? OH, SURE, OF COURSE.
UM, A POCKET TURN LANE IS NOT A FULL LANE.
IT'S A SHORT, UH, APPROXIMATELY 50 TO MAYBE 200 FOOT LANE THAT VEHICLES CAN TURN OFF THE MAIN, UH, TRAVEL LANES INTO IN ORDER TO TAKE THEM OFF OF THE MAIN LANES AND GIVE THEM THEIR OWN EXCLUSIVE LANE TO TURN.
UH, DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? DO YOU WANT ME TO EXPLAIN IT FURTHER? ABSOLUTELY.
AND OF COURSE, THIS'LL REQUIRE A STATE LEGISLATION.
THIS WOULD REQUIRE, SORRY, WAS THERE ANOTHER QUESTION? THIS WOULD REQUIRE A STATE LEGISLATION.
I MEAN, THE STATE WOULD HAVE TO APPROVE, IT'S IN CENTRAL AVENUE, UM, AND WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE OR STATE ROADS, THE STATE HAS TO APPROVE ALL OF THEM.
UM, THEY WOULD HAVE TO APPROVE ALL OF THEM.
AND WE'VE HAD INITIAL CONVERSATIONS WITH NEW YORK STATE, D O T, IN WHICH THEY'RE GENERALLY SUPPORTIVE OF ALL OF THESE IMPROVEMENTS.
UM, GARY, AM I REPRESENTING THAT CORRECTLY? UH, GARY, CAN YOU HEAR ME? YES, THANK YOU.
I I I WAS, I WAS ON MUTE THERE.
UH, YES, WE HAVE HAD, UH, NUMEROUS MEETINGS WITH NEW YORK STATE AND INFORMED THEM OF, UM, UH, THIS STUDY AND, AND SOME OF THE LAND USE PLANNING THAT WE'VE DONE.
AND, UH, YES, INDEED NEW YORK STATE HAS BEEN, UH, VERY SUPPORTIVE.
AND, AND I I WOULD JUST ADD, I THINK THAT IT'S SIGNIFICANT TO NOTE THAT, UM, WHEN NEW YORK STATE D O T WAS INITIALLY, UH, PLANNING TO MAKE THOSE IMPROVEMENTS THAT ELAINE HAD ON THE SCREEN A FEW MOMENTS AGO, UH, THEY DID NOT INCLUDE, UH, A LIGHT DETECTION SYSTEM.
I BELIEVE THEY INCLUDED UPDATED LOOPS AND TIMER, UH, UH, UM, SIGNAL.
AND WE WERE ABLE TO MEET WITH D O T AT THE TIME, UM, PRIOR TO MEETING WITH THE TOWN BOARD IN SEPTEMBER OF LAST YEAR.
AND A K R F ON BEHALF OF THE TOWN PRESENTED THE A T C S STUDY THAT THEY PERFORMED FOR THE TOWN.
UM, AND, AND REALLY SHOWED THE BENEFITS OF WHAT THAT SYSTEM WOULD DO FOR THE CORRIDOR AND, UM, THAT, THAT ACTUALLY HAD THE D O T SHIFT THEIR PLANS THAT THEY LIKED THE NEW, UH, NUMBERS.
UM, AND, AND THE EFFICIENCY THAT THE SYSTEM WOULD, WOULD, WOULD, WOULD REALLY, UH, HAVE US GAIN AND D O T ACTUALLY SWITCHED TO A DETECTION LIGHT SYSTEM, UM, SORT OF MID-PROCESS WORKING WITH THEIR,
[01:00:01]
UM, UM, PRO PROCURE PROCUREMENT PROCESS.SO THAT, THAT WAS ACTUALLY A VERY POSITIVE STEP THAT THAT OCCURRED, UH, MIDSTREAM, IF YOU WILL.
BUT YES, THAT'S THE UPDATE THERE WITH D O T.
YEAH, AND THAT CAMERA DETECTOR THAT D O T IS NOW PROPOSING AS A RESULT OF OUR COLLABORATION WITH THEM, WILL REALLY HELP FACILITATE THE, UH, THE IMP IMPLEMENTATION OF A T C S OR SMART SIGNALS AT THIS INTERSECTION.
UH, TO CONTINUE ON, UH, AN ADDITIONAL TURN, LEMME CONSIDER, JUST ASK ONE FOLLOW UP QUESTION.
IF THE STATE GARRETT IS ALREADY RECEPTIVE TO DOING THIS, UM, IS THIS SOMETHING THAT UM, YOU THERE THAT SAY WITHIN THE NEXT YEAR OR SO THERE'S A GOOD CHANCE THAT IT'S GONNA GET DONE THESE, OR, OR ARE THERE ADDITIONAL ACTION STEPS TO THE TOWN HAS TO TAKE SINCE THEY'RE ALREADY RECEPTIVE? YEAH, SO THIS, THE, THE, THE STEPS THAT THE STATE WILL TAKE, UM, AND THIS PROJECT IS PROJECTED BY THE STATE TO OCCUR, UH, OVER THE COURSE OF THIS SUMMER ARE A D A COMPLIANT RAMPS AT ALL FOUR OF THE INTERSECTIONS.
UH, THE NEW LIGHT SIGNALS, UM, THE DETECTION SYSTEM, THE TURN LANES ARE NOT PART OF THE, THE STATE PROGRAMMED IMPROVEMENTS.
AND, UM, IN, IN MY OPINION, UM, THOSE TURN LANES BECOME MUCH MORE VIABLE WHEN A PRIVATE DEVELOPER AND WE'LL HEAR MORE ABOUT THE PROCESS, BUT WHEN A PRIVATE DEVELOPER, UM, SEEKS TO, UM, BUILD CONSISTENT WITH THE TOWN'S FOUR CORNERS REDEVELOPMENT PLAN, 'CAUSE NOW WHAT YOU HAVE IS THAT PRIVATE DEVELOPER MAKING THOSE TURN POCKETS, UH, AT ZERO EXPENSE TO THE TOWN.
UH, BUT HAVING SAID THAT, YES, WE DO HAVE AN ACTIVE, UM, TAP GRANT APPLICATION OF WHICH, UM, YOU KNOW, SUPER FINGERS CROSSED, UH, WE'VE YET TO HEAR.
BUT, UM, IF WE DO HEAR POSITIVE ON THAT, THAT WILL, UM, GIVE THE TOWN THE FUNDING TO PLACE A SIDEWALK FROM FOUR CORNERS, UH, UP WEST HARTSDALE FOR A DURATION OF ABOUT A MILE IN ADDITION TO, UH, TRAFFIC, CALMING TRAFFIC, PEDESTRIAN SAFETY IMPROVEMENTS ON EAST HARTSDALE AND FULL A T C S.
SO, UM,
IF WE DON'T GET IT, IT'S NOT THE END OF THE WORLD.
WE WILL, YOU KNOW, WE WILL, WE WILL FIGURE OUT OTHER SOURCES.
UM, BUT UM, YEAH, THERE'S ALL SORTS OF OPPORTUNITIES, UM, THAT ARE, THAT ARE BEFORE US AND THAT WILL REALLY, UH, GIVE RISE WITH THE FOUR CORNERS REDEVELOPMENT CONCEPT.
MAYBE, MAYBE WE SHOULD, UH, SEND THEM A COPY OF THIS PRESENTATION SO THEY COULD SEE HOW SERIOUS WE ARE ABOUT, UM, MAKING SOME OF THE SAFETY IMPROVEMENTS AND, UM, ADDRESSING THE WHOLE FOUR CORNER, YOU KNOW, AREA, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE I THINK THAT THIS WOULD PROBABLY IMPRESS THEM.
YEAH, AND IT LOOKS LIKE THERE ARE FEDERAL FUNDING OPPORTUNITIES THAT MIGHT BE APPLICABLE AS WELL.
MEGAN HAD SENT OUT THAT EMAIL.
UM, SO JUST TO ADD ON TO WHAT GARRETT HAD SAID, YES, THESE, UH, THESE TURN POCKET, THESE POCKET TURN POCKET LANE IMPROVEMENTS WOULD BE TIED TO EACH DEVELOPMENT.
AND ONE OF THE THOUGHTS, UH, WE HAD TOGETHER WAS TYING IN EACH TURN POCKET TO EACH, UH, TO EACH OF THESE CORNERS.
SO FOR INSTANCE, THE WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE TURN POCKET WOULD BE TIED TO THE DALE CORNER REDEVELOPMENT.
UM, CENTRAL, THE SOUTHBOUND CENTRAL PARK AVE TURN POCKET WOULD BE TIED TO DWAYNE REED AND SO ON.
UM, ANOTHER IDEA WE HAD IN MIND WAS ADDING A TURN POCKET ON EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE, WHICH WOULD EX, WHICH IS NOT FEASIBLE TODAY AS THERE IS DEVELOPMENT UP TO HERE.
UH, SO IN THAT CASE, THE REDEVELOPMENT WOULD BE ABLE TO PROVIDE THIS OPPORTUNITY.
HOWEVER, UM, WE'RE NOT CERTAIN IF A DEVELOPER WOULD HAVE THE TASTE TO DO THIS.
SO TO BE CONSERVATIVE, WE DIDN'T INCLUDE THIS TURN POCKET, THE WESTBOUND TURN POCKET FROM EAST DALE AVENUE IN OUR ANALYSIS.
SO THAT WAS REALLY JUST TO BE CONSERVATIVE AND TO MODEL WHAT IS POSSIBLE TO HAPPEN.
SO IN ORDER TO EXAMINE THE REDEVELOPMENT POTENTIAL, UM, AGAIN, GOING THROUGH THE PROCESS FROM THE BEGINNING, WE COLLECTED A LOT OF DATA.
UH, WE DID EXTE, WE COLLABORATED EXTENSIVELY WITH THE TOWN, VARIOUS STAKEHOLDERS, AND FROM THERE, WE REVIEWED EXISTING CONDITIONS FOR TRAFFIC, FOR PEDESTRIANS, FOR PARKING ACCESS MANAGEMENT.
WE LOOKED AT WHAT'S HAPPENING AT FOUR CORNERS IN THE BACKGROUND, AS WELL AS WHAT WE COULD DO TO IMPROVE TRAFFIC, SO THAT DEVELOPMENT COULD OCCUR HERE.
[01:05:01]
THIS INITIAL DEVELOPMENT SER SCENARIO, WHICH COULD HAVE, WHICH WAS, WE WON'T PRESENT THIS TODAY, BUT IT WAS A MAXIMUM POSSIBLE DEVELOPMENT THAT IS, UH, IN LINE WITH ZONING CODE.AND FROM THERE, WE RAN SEVERAL ITERATIONS.
WE RAN ANALYSIS FOR VARIOUS SCENARIOS, AND WE REALLY GOT TO A POINT WHERE, UM, WE DEVELOPED THIS, THE FINAL THEORETICAL DEVELOPMENT SCENARIO.
I DON'T WANNA CALL IT FINAL, BECAUSE AGAIN, A DEVELOPER COULD COME IN AND CHANGE THINGS.
HOWEVER, THIS IS A THEORETICAL DEVELOPMENT SCENARIO IN WHICH, UM, IT IS AN ACCEPTABLE LEVEL OF DEVELOPMENT TO THE TOWN WHILE STILL MAINTAINING, UH, TRAFFIC CONDITIONS THAT ARE COMPARABLE AND BETTER TO WHAT'S HAPPENING OUT THERE TODAY.
SO FROM THERE, UM, THE THEORETICAL DEVELOPMENT SCENARIO INCLUDES APPROXIMATELY 450 DWELLING UNITS THROUGH ALL OF THESE PARCELS AND APPROXIMATELY 60,000 SQUARE FEET OF COMMERCIAL, UH, RETAIL RESTAURANT AND OFFICE SPACE.
UM, AND THIS IS THROUGH ALL OF THESE CORNERS, AND WE SPLIT UP, FOR INSTANCE, UM, UH, THE SOUTH CORNERS, WHICH ARE PRETTY LARGE.
WE SPLIT EACH OF THESE UP INTO TWO PARCELS, WHEREAS THE NORTH CORNERS WE KEPT AS ONE OF ONE EACH.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT YOU'LL SEE GOING FORWARD.
I'LL REFER TO THEM AS NORTHWEST MORE EAST SOUTHWEST ONE, UH, SOUTHWEST TWO, SOUTHEAST ONE AND SOUTHEAST TWO.
SO THIS IS JUST TO SHOW YOU WHAT OUR THEORETICAL DEVELOPMENT SCENARIO IS IN TERMS OF HOW MUCH DEVELOPMENT THERE IS.
AND AGAIN, JUST TO SUMMARIZE, IT'S APPROXIMATELY FOUR 50 RESIDENTIAL UNITS, 60,000 SQUARE FEET OF COMMERCIAL RETAIL OFFICE SPACE.
UM, AND THIS WOULD EQUATE TO APPROXIMATELY FOUR STORIES.
UM, WE TOOK OUR, WE TOOK THIS DEVELOPMENT SCENARIO.
WE, WE ESTIMATED HOW MANY TRIPS COULD BE GENERATED THROUGH THIS REDEVELOPMENT, AND WE ADDED IT TO OUR TRAFFIC NETWORK.
AND FROM THIS, WE WERE ABLE TO GET RESULTS.
UH, THIS, THESE RESULTS INCLUDE, AGAIN, THE IMPROVEMENTS THAT WE DISCUSSED BEFORE, UM, THE TURN POCKETS, THE ADAPTIVE TRAFFIC CONTROL SIGNAL SYSTEM, AND ALL THESE IMPROVEMENTS.
SO AS YOU CAN SEE ON THE LEFT HAND SIDE, HERE ARE THE EXISTING CONDITIONS THAT WE DISCUSSED BEFORE, WHERE EVERYTHING IS OPERATING, UH, AT AN A LEVEL OF SERVICE E, WHICH IS NOT GREAT.
HOWEVER, WITH THE, THE THEORETICAL DEVELOPMENT SCENARIO AND ALL OF THESE IMPROVEMENTS, WE WERE ABLE TO GET SOME MAJOR, WE WERE ABLE TO EXPERIENCE SOME LEVEL OF IMPROVEMENT AT THE INTERSECTION.
SO AS YOU CAN SEE, WE'RE OPERATING AT A LEVEL OF SERVICE D IN THE A M P PEAK HOUR, WHICH IS ACCEPTABLE, UH, FOR VARIOUS, FOR DOWNTOWN LOCATIONS, FOR CENTRAL BUSINESS DISTRICT LOCATIONS.
AND IN THE P M PEAK HOUR, ALTHOUGH WE STILL OPERATE AT LEVEL OF SERVICE E IT'S BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAD.
WHAT, WHAT'S OUT THERE TODAY, A, IN TERMS OF PARKING, WE UNDERSTAND THAT IN ORDER TO BETTER SERVE WHAT'S GOING TO BE OUT THERE IN FOUR CORNERS, THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE PARKING, UH, IN ORDER TO SUPPORT ALL OF THE RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT, ALL OF THE COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT.
SO BASED ON, UH, PARKING REQUIREMENTS THAT ARE SUPPORTIVE OF TRANSIT ORIENTED, UH, DEVELOPMENTS, WE WERE ABLE TO DEVELOP A, A GENERAL PARKING REQUIREMENT FOR EACH OF THESE CORNERS.
IT TOTALS TO APPROXIMATELY 900 SPACES.
AND WHAT WE ENVISION IS MULTI-LEVEL PARKING GARAGES THAT ARE CONSOLIDATED FOR EACH CORNER.
AND THESE, UH, THESE PARKING GARAGES WOULD NOT BE, UH, VIEWABLE FROM STREET LEVEL, LIKE MOST DOWNTOWN AREAS.
INSTEAD, THEY WOULD BE SCREENED.
SO YOU WOULD HAVE COMMERCIAL AND RESIDENTIAL SPACE, LIKELY MORE COMMERCIAL SPACE AROUND THESE PARKING GARAGES.
SO YOU ACCESS THEM FROM THE BACK AND OUT FRONT WHERE YOU WALK ON THE SIDEWALK, ALL YOU SEE ARE THE STORES.
UM, THE OTHER IDEA WE HAD WAS WE NEED TO MAINTAIN AND POTENTIALLY EXPAND THE HARTSDALE SIGHTSEE PARKING LOT.
UH, THAT IS UNDER THE, UNDER THE HARTSDALE PARKING DISTRICT.
UM, AND THAT'S REALLY TO BETTER SERVE ALL THE RESIDENTS AND COMMUTERS OF THIS AREA.
UM, ADDITIONALLY, UH, 900 PARKING SPACES IS A LOT.
UM, SO SOME OTHER ITEMS THAT THE TOWN COULD CONSIDER ARE ALLOWING VARIOUS CREDITS TO REDUCE THE PARKING REQUIREMENTS, SUCH AS SHARED PARKING CREDITS AND LOWER LOWERED REQUIREMENTS FOR VARIOUS LAND USES.
UM, UH, I JUST HAD A QUESTION ABOUT THE PARKING.
UM, IF YOU COULD JUST GO BACK WHERE IT SAYS, MAINTAIN AND EXPAND HARTSDALE SITE C PARKING LOT.
UM, IS, ARE, ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT POSSIBLY ALSO, UM, CREATING LIKE
[01:10:01]
A MIXED USE, UH, DEVELOPMENT FOR THE PARKING DISTRICT TO SAY, SELL THE, THE LOT AND HAVE BOTH PARKING AND, UM, MIXED USE OR JUST PARKING IN, IN GENERAL? UM, THE WAY THAT I THINK IT'S, IT'S BEST TO THINK ABOUT THE HARTSDALE PUBLIC PARKING DISTRICT, UH, SITE C DOWN THERE IS TO SIMPLY, UH, TREAT IT AS A POTENTIAL OPPORTUNITY.SO IF THERE'S A SCENARIO WHERE THE EXISTING PROPERTY OWNERS ARE ABLE TO, UM, WORK WITH AN ARCHITECT AND AN ENGINEER AND PRESENT A CONCEPT THAT EXPANDS THE PARKING FOR HARTSDALE SITE C I THINK IT'S PREMATURE TO INDICATE WHETHER IT WOULD MAKE SENSE FOR THAT SITE TO BE SOLD.
OR PERHAPS, UM, YOU KNOW, THERE COULD BE A SCENARIO WHERE, UM, A MULTI-LEVEL PARKING, UH, SITE IS, IS DEVELOPED AND THEN TRANSFERRED OVER TO THE, TO THE PARKING DISTRICT.
I THINK THERE'S A VARIETY OF, OF WAYS IT COULD OCCUR AND, AND OCCUR SUCCESSFULLY.
UM, BUT I THINK AT THIS EARLY STAGE, UM, YOU KNOW, ON A, ON A SHEER DEVELOPMENT LEVEL, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE, UM, SQUARE FOOTAGE OF SPACE IN THE ACREAGE, FROM AN AERIAL PHOTO SENSE, UM, YOU KNOW, IT'S, IT'S READILY APPARENT THAT WHEN YOU COMBINE THOSE TWO LOTS, UM, YOU HAVE QUITE A BIT MORE FLEXIBILITY, UM, TO, YOU KNOW, TO HAVE REAR PARKING LANES AND, AND MORE AREA FOR, UM, A PARKING DISTRICT.
SO, UM, WHAT WE'VE, WHEN WE MET WITH THE PARKING DISTRICT, I DESCRIBED IN, IN JUST THIS FASHION, AND, UM, TO REALLY JUST, JUST REALLY SEE IF AS WE CONTINUE TO PLAN, UM, A PRIVATE DEVELOPER CAN WORK WITH THE PARKING DISTRICT IN A PUBLIC-PRIVATE, UH, PARTNERSHIP FASHION, AND REALLY SEE WHAT THE POSSIBILITIES ARE WITH, YOU KNOW, COMBINING OR NOT COMBINING THOSE LOTS.
I, I DID WANNA NOTE THAT, UM, WE DO, AND, AND OTHER UNI MUNICIPALITIES THAT WE'VE WORKED WITH, UH, IN WHICH DEVELOPERS BUY PRI BUY PUBLIC LOTS.
UM, WE'VE SEEN THEM ALSO HAVE CONTRACTS TO GIVE A CERTAIN NUMBER OF PARKING SPACES BACK TO THE MUNICIPALITY.
AND LIKE GARRETT SAID, THERE ARE DIFFERENT POSSIBILITIES TO SEE WHAT THE DEVELOPERS ENVISION.
UM, SO IN ADDITION TO NEW DR NEW PARKING LOTS TO BETTER SUPPORT FOR CORNERS, UH, WE ALSO ENVISION IMPROVING, YOU KNOW, CONSOLIDATING, CONSOLIDATING THE 20 PLUS DRIVEWAYS DOWN TO ONLY A COUPLE OF DRIVEWAYS.
UM, THIS REALLY HELPS WITH, UH, IMPROVING, JUST REDUCING THAT TRAFFIC FRICTION ALONG CENTRAL AVENUE AND ALONG HARTSDALE AVENUE.
AND THIS WAS AN IDEA THAT NEW YORK STATE D O T WAS HIGHLY SUPPORTIVE OF.
UM, SO TURNING 10 DRIVEWAYS INTO ONE DRIVEWAY HELPS TRAFFIC A LOT.
UM, AND THIS, WE ENVISION THIS TO A LOT, AS YOU CAN SEE HERE, UM, A SINGLE SHARED DRIVEWAY FOR THESE TWO DEVELOPMENT PARCELS.
UH, WE, THIS WOULD BE, UM, THIS WOULD BE MOST CONDUCIVE TO IMPROVING TRAFFIC FOR FOUR CORNERS.
SO THESE DRIVEWAYS WOULD BE A COMBINATION OF BOTH FULL ACCESS DRIVEWAYS, WHICH ALLOW BOTH LEFT AND RIGHT TURNS, OR RIGHT AND RIGHT OUT DRIVEWAYS, WHICH D O T IS MORE PUSHING MORE FOR IN TERMS OF PRIVATE DEVELOPMENT.
AND FINALLY, UH, WE UNDERSTAND THAT THERE ARE, THERE'S THIS, A VERY STRONG NEED FOR SAFETY AND PEDESTRIAN IMPROVEMENTS IN THE AREA.
AND A FEW THINGS THAT WE SUGGEST ARE, UH, VARIOUS SIGNAL IMPROVEMENTS LIKE REFLECTORIZED BACK PLATES FOR ALL TRAFFIC SIGNAL HEADS, AND THOSE ARE, UM, I'M SURE YOU'VE SEEN THESE WHEN DRIVING AROUND, WHEREAS THIS IS KIND OF A NAKED TRAFFIC SIGNAL, OR REFLECTORIZED BACK PLATE IS LIKE A YELLOW PLATE ON THE BACK TO, UM, SO, SO YOU CAN SEE IT OUTLINES THE TRAFFIC SIGNAL AND IT REALLY HIGHLIGHTS THE, UH, THE SIGNAL FOR DRIVERS TO ALERT THEM BETTER TO WHAT'S TO THE SIGNAL THAT'S THERE.
UM, ANOTHER IDEA IS HAVING LANE LINE EXTENSIONS, WHICH ARE THE DASHED LINES, THE DASHED LINES IN THE MIDDLE OF AN INTERSECTION TO SHOW VEHICLES WHERE THEY NEED TO GO.
AND IT REALLY DELINEATES SPACE FOR PARTICULARLY LEFT TURNING VEHICLES.
AND WE'VE HEARD ALL THE COMPLAINTS FROM THE HARTSDALE NEIGHBORS ASSOCIATION.
UM, ROADWAY LIGHTING IMPROVEMENTS ARE NEEDED ALONG EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE FOR VEHICLES.
AND IN ORDER TO IMPROVE PEDESTRIAN CONDITIONS, UM, BUILDINGS, UM, BUILDINGS AT FOUR CORNERS, THE PROPOSED REDEVELOPMENT, UM, SETBACKS SHOULD BE PUSHED BACK IN ORDER TO PROVIDE WIDER SIDEWALKS FOR PEDESTRIANS.
FIVE FOOT WIDE SHOULD BE THE BARE MINIMUM, BUT, UH, EIGHT FOOT WIDE, UM, EIGHT FOOT WIDE PLUS IS REALLY WHAT WE NEED FOR A BETTER, MORE WALKABLE AREA THAT IS CONDUCIVE TO TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT.
[01:15:01]
AND THIS COULD REALLY HELP FOR CORNERS THAT COULD BE WHAT IT COULD BE FOR THE TOWN.AND AT THIS POINT, UM, I DON'T BELIEVE WE'RE TAKING QUESTIONS, BUT I THINK I'M PASSING IT ON TO GARRETT.
PASSING IT ON TO JUSTIN, RIGHT, GARRETT.
UM, WHAT I THINK I MAKE SENSE IS TO TURN IT OVER TO THE TOWN BOARD FOR QUESTIONS BEFORE WE GET TO, UH, THE STORM WATER, UM, COMPONENT OF THE PRESENTATION.
IF, IF THERE ARE ANY QUESTIONS, I HAVEN'T RECEIVED ANY QUESTIONS VIA EMAIL FROM, FROM RESIDENTS TO DATE.
SO ALL THESE RECOMMENDATIONS, UM, MOST OF THEM YOU WOULD RECOMMEND THAT WE WAIT UNTIL IT'S REDEVELOPED AND YOU KNOW, HOW MANY COULD BE DONE BEFORE THERE'S A REDEVELOPMENT PROPOSAL.
THAT'S THE MAIN THOUGHT THAT THESE VARIOUS DEVELOPMENTS COULD BE TIED INTO IMPROVEMENT TO THE REDEVELOPMENT IN THE AREA.
SO LIKE I MENTIONED BEFORE, UM, EACH CORNER WOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR OWN SET OF DEVELOP, UH, FOR THEIR OWN SET OF IMPROVEMENTS, BUT I'M SURE GARRETT COULD ELABORATE FURTHER.
SO THE, THE TYPES OF IMPROVEMENTS THAT REALLY ARE CHALLENGING TO MAKE NOW, UM, ARE THINGS LIKE DRIVEWAY CONSOLIDATIONS.
THERE'S REALLY, UM, MINIMAL SCENARIO WHERE A DRIVEWAY CONSOLIDATION CAN HAPPEN AT PRESENT.
UM, I DO BELIEVE THE TURN LANES, UM, I DON'T SEE, UH, THE MOTIVATION OF A PRIVATE PROPERTY OWNER TO MAKE THEM AT THIS TIME.
UM, SO I THINK THE, THE TYPES OF UPDATES THAT WE'RE GOING TO REALLY PRESS FOR ARE THE PEDESTRIAN UPDATES SUCH AS SIDEWALKS UP WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE, UM, LIGHTING EAST HARSDALE AVENUE, PEDESTRIAN IMPROVEMENTS, EAST HARSDALE AVENUE, UM, ADAPTIVE TRAFFIC CONTROL SYSTEMS, EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE.
UM, BUT IN TERMS OF NEXT, NEXT STEPS, WHAT WE CAN DO IS TAKE THIS REPORT AND REALLY AS A MUNICIPALITY START TO THINK ABOUT TYPE OF ZONING, UH, THAT WOULD ENABLE THE TYPES OF DENSITIES THAT WERE JUST DESCRIBED.
UM, THAT, THAT'S REALLY THE NEXT STEP.
THE CA DISTRICT, UM, IN NO WAY, SHAPE OR FORM WOULD ENABLE THIS TYPE OF MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT.
IN FACT, THE CA DISTRICT, UH, DOES NOT ALLOW, UH, RESIDENTIAL OVER COMMERCIAL OR RESIDENTIAL OVER NON-RESIDENTIAL.
SO JUST PURELY ON A USE BASIS.
UH, YOU HAVE A DISTRICT THAT DOES NOT WORK.
BUT, UM, THE, THE, THE KEY TO THIS WHOLE EQUATION IS REALLY THE TOWN WORKING WITH THE PUBLIC PROCESS, UM, WORKING WITH, YOU KNOW, CIVIC ASSOCIATION LEADERS, GETTING THAT, YOU KNOW, BUY-IN ON FOLLOWING THROUGH WHAT WE DID WITH THE FOUR CORNERS REDEVELOPMENT PLAN.
YOU KNOW, ENSURING RESIDENTS THAT THIS IS NOT, YOU KNOW, NEW ROCHELLE OR WHITE PLAINS.
WE'RE NOT LOOKING TO BRING IN, UH, NINE, 10 STORY BUILDINGS.
UM, BUT REALLY BUILDINGS THAT ARE APPROPRIATE FOR THE TOWN OF GREENBURG.
WHEN YOU SET THE ZONING REGULATIONS TO MEET WHAT YOUR GOALS ARE FOR THE TOWN, UM, THERE'S REALLY NO CURVE WALLS.
YOU KNOW, THE DEVELOPMENT COMPUTE COMMUNITY LIKES THAT SURETY.
UM, THEY KNOW WHAT THEIR OBLIGATIONS ARE TO ENHANCE THE AREA, AND THEY KNOW, YOU KNOW, THE, THE SCALE AND, AND TYPES OF DEVELOPMENTS THAT THE TOWN SEEKS.
SO, UM, THAT'S REALLY KIND OF THE NEXT STEPS.
START THINKING ABOUT, UH, REZONING STRATEGIES.
IN TERMS OF, UM, YOU KNOW, I THINK IN YOUR PRESENTATION YOU SAID THAT THERE COULD BE ABOUT 450, UH, UNITS OF, UM, YOU KNOW, HOUSING.
DO YOU FEEL WITH AN AREA THAT'S SO, YOU KNOW, CONGESTED RIGHT NOW THAT, UH, THAT THE AREA COULD HANDLE, YOU KNOW, 450 OR EVEN 250, UH, MULTIFAMILY, UH, UNITS, ASSUMING, YOU KNOW, THE, THESE, UH, RECOMMENDATIONS ARE MADE? OF COURSE.
ELAINE
SO WE DO BELIEVE THAT 450 IS FEASIBLE, AND WE EVEN TESTED SCENARIOS THAT ARE EVEN MORE, WE TESTED, I DON'T WANT TO SAY THE NUMBERS, BUT WE TESTED MORE THAN 450 AND ALL THOSE, ALTHOUGH THOSE ARE STILL FEASIBLE, WE DON'T SEE THOSE TRAFFIC IMPROVEMENTS.
SO WE UNDERSTAND THAT THE TOWN WANTS TO NOT ONLY BUILD AT FOUR CORNERS, BUT ALSO IMPROVE TRAFFIC AND IMPROVE, UH, TRAFFIC CONDITIONS FOR PEOPLE TRAVELING THROUGH THE INTERSECTION AND FOR THE TOWN.
UM, SO THIS LEVEL OF DEVELOPMENT REALLY HELPS TO UNLOCK THAT TRAFFIC POTENTIAL.
WELL, AND THE CHART THAT YOU SHOWED, IT SHOWED THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE'S, THERE COULD BE SOME IMPROVEMENTS AT CERTAIN TIMES OF DAYS, BUT IT SEEMED LIKE THE BUILD OUT, EXCEPT IN, IN ONE SITUATION THAT WAS NOTABLE, UH, MAINTAINS THE SA SAME OR NOT TOO DISSIMILAR LEVEL OF SERVICE, UH, WITH ALL THESE IMPROVEMENTS, UH, I'M NOT SO SURE THE RESIDENTS ARE LOOKING FOR HAVING SIMILAR,
[01:20:01]
SIMILAR LEVELS OF SERVICE, YOU KNOW, BUT, YOU KNOW, SO WE'LL DO ALL OF THESE CHANGES, WE'LL MAKE IT IMPROVED, WE'LL PUT IN MORE UNITS, UM, AND YOU'LL HAVE THE SAME LEVEL OF SERVICE.BUT YOU KNOW, FORTUNATELY BECAUSE OF THE IMPROVEMENTS, UH, WE'LL HAVE MORE, MORE UNITS.
UH, WAS THERE AN ANALYSIS DONE TO SEE, UM, WITH MAYBE NOT SO MANY UNITS, WHETHER OR NOT WE COULD ACTUALLY GET FROM A D OR AN E TO A B, UH, OR WAS THE GOAL TO MAINTAIN SOMEWHAT THE SAME LEVEL OF SERVICE, BUT SEE HOW MANY MORE UNITS WE CAN GET IN WITH THE IMPROVEMENTS THAT YOU'RE MAKING? SO TYPICALLY SPEAKING LEVEL OF SERVICE B IS MORE APPROPRIATE FOR RURAL AREAS, FOR AREAS THAT DON'T EXPERIENCE AS MUCH TRAFFIC.
SO FOR A MAJOR COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR, FOR A DOWNTOWN AREA THAT'S, UH, THAT HAS A LOT OF DEVELOPMENT AND PEDESTRIAN ACTIVITY, LEVEL OF SERVICED IS WHERE I WOULD SAY OUR SWEET SPOT IN WHICH VEHICLES DON'T EXPERIENCE A LOT OF DELAY.
BUT AT THE SAME TIME, WE KNOW WE'RE PROCESSING A LOT OF TRAFFIC.
UM, SO WE LIKE TO SEE A LEVEL OF SERVICED.
AND IN TERMS OF THE, UM, AND WE DO SEE A LEVEL OF SERVICED IN THE P M P HOUR BASED ON OUR ANALYSIS IN TERMS OF THE P PEAK HOUR, WE DO NOTE THAT, UM, IT STILL OPERATES AT LEVEL OF SERVICE E BUT SLIGHTLY BETTER.
HOWEVER, UM, WE, WE DO WANT TO NOTE THAT THE WAY WE ANALYZED THE SCENARIO WITH THE ADAPTIVE TRAFFIC CONTROL SYSTEM, UM, IN ACTUALITY THE A A ADAPTIVE TRAFFIC CONTROL SYSTEM MAY OPERATE BETTER THAN WHAT WE ANALYZED.
UH, SO OUR ANALYSIS SOFTWARE IS SOMEWHAT CONSERVATIVE, BUT, UH, THE WAY THAT THE SMART SIGNALS WOULD PROCESS TRAFFIC, THE ACTUAL CONDITIONS COULD BE BETTER.
UM, MIKE, IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE YOU WANT TO ADD TO THAT? YEAH, JUST A, A COUPLE OTHER ITEMS. UM, ONE THING TO NOTE IS JUST FOR THIS INTERSECTION ITSELF, THERE REALLY ISN'T A SCENARIO WHERE YOU CAN IMPROVE THIS TO THAT LEVEL SERVICE B, BECAUSE THE NATURE OF THE SIGNAL ITSELF, ELAINE TALKED ABOUT EARLIER ABOUT THE ALL PED PHASE, VERY IMPORTANT TO HAVE THAT FOR PEDESTRIAN SAFETY.
BUT IF YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT TRAFFIC MOVING, NO TRAFFIC MOVES DURING THAT TIME.
SO IT'D BE ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE TO GET A BETTER LEVEL OF SERVICE BECAUSE OF THAT PEDESTRIAN SAFETY ELEMENT.
UM, THERE ARE ELEMENTS THAT ALSO WE CAN'T CAPTURE IN THE MODEL.
FOR INSTANCE, ELAINE TALKS ABOUT THE ACCESS MANAGEMENT THAT HAS A BIG EFFECT ON CORRIDOR TRAVEL TIMES, PEOPLE SLOWING DOWN TO GO INTO A DRIVEWAY, PEOPLE COMING UP FROM MULTIPLE DRIVEWAYS, CONSOLIDATING THOSE MAY NOT SHOW UP IN LOCAL SERVICE SHOWS UP IN THE REAL WORLD.
UM, AND LASTLY, EVEN THOUGH THE LEVEL OF SERVICE IS SIMILAR TO WHAT'S OUT THERE TODAY, WHAT YOU'RE NOT GETTING IS THE PEDESTRIAN IMPROVEMENTS TO SIDEWALKS.
UH, WE SHOWED THE PICTURE OF EAST HARTSDALE WITH THE SIDEWALK THAT'S MAYBE THREE FEET WIDE WITHOUT REDEVELOPMENT.
THAT'S HOW WALK CANNOT BE WIDER THAN THAT.
UM, SO IT'S TRUE THE LEVEL SERVICE IS SIMILAR, WHICH SHOWS THAT WE COULD TAKE ON THE ADDITIONAL THESE, THESE UNITS AND NOT REALLY DEGRADE THE SYSTEMS OF FAILURE.
UM, BUT YOU KNOW, THERE THERE'S ELEMENTS OF THE SIGNAL ITSELF THAT REALLY PROHIBIT IT TO BEING A LEVEL SERVICE B OR C.
'CAUSE THAT PET PHASE AND THAT IN DISCUSSION WITH D O T, NOT THAT WE WOULDN'T EVEN RECOMMEND IT, EVEN IF WE DID D O T WOULD PROBABLY SHOOT US DOWN PRETTY QUICKLY.
IT IS REALLY HARD TO GET RID OF AN ALLED PHASE.
UM, SO I JUST WANTED TO ADD THOSE OTHER INFORMATION.
SO OF THE, SORRY, THE 450 UNITS, IS THAT, ARE THEY ENVISIONED TO BE, UH, NEWLY BUILT CONDOS RENTALS? THEY WOULD BE, UM, MULTI-FAMILY BUILDINGS.
UM, COULD BE RENTAL, THEY COULD BE FOR SALE.
UM, YOU KNOW, TYPICALLY THAT IS A FUNCTION OF, OF WHAT THE, YOU KNOW, MARKET, UM, MAKES MOST SENSE FOR THE MARKET.
YOU MENTIONED IN ALL INSTANCES THERE WOULD BE A 10% AFFORDABLE HOUSING COMPONENT TO THAT.
YOU MENTIONED THAT YOU DIDN'T INCLUDE CONDOS, 'CAUSE IT'D BE, COULD BE MARKET RATE CONDOS OR RENTALS.
IS THAT THE THREE POSSIBILITIES? I GUESS IT COULD BE CONDO, CO-OP OR RENTAL OR CO-OP.
JUST, YOU KNOW, JUST IT WOULD SEEM THAT, YOU KNOW, I THINK IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN WE WOULD, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT 50 UNITS PER CORNER.
UH, THIS IS NOW AT 450 UNITS, UH, FOR THE FOUR CORNERS.
[01:25:01]
YOU HAD HALF THE NUMBER OF UNITS, YOU WOULD HAVE HALF THE NUMBER OF VEHICLES ADDING TO THE WAIT TIMES AT THE LIGHTS.UH, BUT WHAT I'M HEARING YOU SAY IS THAT IT'S INHERENT IN THE CORNER ITSELF, THAT THAT'S NOT THE CASE.
AND THE D LEVEL OF SERVICE IS THE OBJECTIVE.
IS THAT WHAT I'M HEARING? UM, ONE IMPORTANT THING TO, TO NOTE, CORRECT.
UH, ONE IMPORTANT THING TO NOTE IS THAT ALTHOUGH IT IS LOGICAL THAT, UM, LESS DEVELOPMENT EQUALS LESS TRAFFIC, A LOT OF IT IS BACKGROUND TRAFFIC THAT'S TRAVELING THROUGH FOUR CORNERS.
SO A LOT OF THE PEOPLE TRAVELING THROUGH FOUR CORNERS AREN'T GOING TO DESTINATIONS THERE.
THEY'RE GOING THROUGH DOWN TO YONKERS OR UP TO WHITE PLAINS.
UM, BUT IT'S, IT'S A FUNCTION OF THE BACKGROUND TRAFFIC AND WE, UH, WE REALLY NEED TO LOOK AT IT.
WE, WE LOOKED INTO THE BACKGROUND TRAFFIC, WE DID THE TRAFFIC COUNTS.
SO LET ME A FOLLOW UP TO YOUR QUESTION.
SO RIGHT NOW, THIS IS RATED, YOU SAID A D YES, THAT'S CORRECT.
AND IF WE, AND IF WE, UM, DO THE TRAFFIC IMPROVEMENTS THAT YOU'RE RECOMMENDING, UM, AND YOU HAD, THE FOUR 50 WILL BE IN BETTER SHAPE THAN WE ARE NOW, BUT LET'S, LET'S ASSUME WE WENT, SO LET'S SAY INSTEAD OF A D IT WOULD BE, UH, A C PLUS, YOU KNOW, OR WHATEVER, OR A C MINUS.
IF WE, IF WE BASICALLY, IT'S NOT COLLEGE, IT DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY, MADE LIKE 250 UNITS RATHER THAN FOUR 50, WOULD THEN THE, THERE'D BE LESS TRAFFIC.
AND THEN IS IT POSSIBLE THAT IF FRANCIS IAN'S, YOU KNOW, IF YOUR ARGUMENT IS CORRECT, THAT IT COULD BE A B, OR, I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S A B, BUT IT WOULD MAKE SENSE THAT YEAH, IT WOULDN'T BE, IT WOULDN'T BE AS BAD AS IT WOULD BE IF YOU HAD TWICE THE DEVELOPMENT BECAUSE ALL OF THE, ALL OF THE PEOPLE COMING OUT OF THE UNITS ON THOSE CORNERS ARE GOING TO WANT TO COME INTO THE INTERSECTION THAT ALL THE REST OF THE NEIGHBORS, THE HAR YOU KNOW, COMING DOWN THE HILL, YOU KNOW, FROM HARTSDALE GOING TO THE TRAIN STATION, THEY HAVE TO MAKE IT THROUGH THE GAUNTLET OF ALL THE, UH, NO MATTER HOW FEW DRIVEWAYS YOU HAVE.
AND OF COURSE, I DON'T KNOW WHETHER OR NOT THE FEW OF THE DRIVEWAYS THE LONGER IS THE BACKUP ON THOSE DRIVEWAYS TO GET OUT ACTUALLY ONTO EAST HARSDALE AVENUE.
I, I, I, I'M JUST, I WAS JUST CURIOUS WHEN I SAW THE CHART AS TO THE LEVELS OF SERVICE.
ANOTHER THING THAT, YOU KNOW, JUST AS A FOLLOW UP, YOU KNOW, I THINK TO MAKE THE FOUR CORNER REDEVELOPMENT OF REALITY, UM, THERE'S A POINT WHERE PEOPLE ARE GONNA BE REALLY NERVOUS WITH ALL THE TRAFFIC.
SO IF YOU SAY FOUR 50 UNITS, YOU'RE SEEING, YOU KNOW, INITIALLY PEOPLE MAY BE SO SCARED THAT IT'S NOT GONNA GET TO THE NEXT LEVEL.
ON OTHER HAND, IF WE, IF WE COME IN WITH, UM, SMALLER NUMBERS INITIALLY, UH, I THINK THAT THERE MAY BE MORE, UH, OPENNESS FROM THE COMMUNITY MM-HMM.
WELL, THERE ARE A COUPLE OF FACTORS TOO.
IF, IF WE ARE PROMOTING TRANS ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT, THEN YOU'LL HAVE PEOPLE WALKING TO THE TRAIN STATION.
RIGHT? SO IT'S NOT LIKE SOME ONE OR TWO PEOPLE OF EACH OF THE 450 UNITS ARE GONNA COME OUT AT THE SAME TIME, GET INTO THEIR CAR, ESPECIALLY, YOU KNOW, IF, IF MORAYS HAVE CHANGED IN TERMS OF WORK, IF PEOPLE ARE WORKING, NOT WORKING FIVE DAYS A WEEK, NINE TO FIVE.
UM, SO THERE ARE ANY NUMBER OF FACTORS.
AND I'M ASSUMING THAT YOU LOOKED INTO THAT IN, IN YOUR CALCULATIONS, BECAUSE IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU WERE PRETTY THOROUGH.
BUT YOU TOOK, IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU TOOK WORST CASE SCENARIO AND STILL WITH THE, WITH THE, THE TIMED LIGHTING THAT ADJUSTS AND WITH THE IMPROVED OTHER TRAFFIC PATTERNS, THE LIGHTING PATTERNS, A LONG HARTSDALE AVENUE THAT, THAT WE'RE CONSIDERING THAT THEIR STUDIES ARE SHOWING AT A ONLY SPECIFIC PERIODS OF TIME, RIGHT.
BRUSH HOUR AT THE HEIGHT OF WHAT, CAN YOU DEFINE THAT WHEN, WHEN THE WORST TRAFFIC WOULD BE THE HOURS, AND SURE.
IT'S JUST THE WORST COMMUTER PEAK HOURS BETWEEN, I BELIEVE IT WAS SEVEN 30 TO EIGHT 30 IN THE MORNING, AND IN THE AFTERNOON IT WAS FIVE 30 TO SIX 30, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, BUT JUST THE MAIN PEAK HOUR OF COMMUTER TRAFFIC.
AND I DO WANT TO NOTE THAT, YES, WE WERE CONSERVATIVE IN OUR ANALYSIS, AND
[01:30:01]
BECAUSE IT IS A TRANSIT-ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT, WE WOULD ANTICIPATE MORE PEOPLE TO BE WALKING TO AND FROM HARTSDALE, UH, THE HARTSDALE TRAIN STATION, HOWEVER, WE TOOK ONLY A 10%.WE ASSUMED ONLY 10% OF PEOPLE WOULD BE DOING THAT.
AND THAT IS A VERY CONSERVATIVE, UM, A CONSERVATIVE VALUE.
AND IN MOST TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENTS, WE WOULD SEE A NUMBER MUCH HIGHER THAN THAT, CLOSER TO 20, 30, 40%.
UM, ALSO, UH, SUPERVISOR FINER, I JUST WANT TO BACKTRACK VERY SLIGHTLY AND TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT EXISTING CONDITIONS.
UM, I, I WANTED TO CORRECT MYSELF IN THAT.
IN THE AM M PEAK HOUR AND PM M PEAK HOUR, RIGHT NOW, EVERYTHING OPERATES AT LEVEL OF SERVICE E UM, WITH DEVELOPMENT, WITH THE IMPROVEMENTS IN THE AM WE'RE OPERATING AT A LEVEL OF SERVICE D AND IN PM WE'RE OPERATING AT LEVEL OF SERVICE E.
HOWEVER, UH, WHEN WE DID ALSO RUN A SCENARIO WHERE THERE'S NO DEVELOPMENT, NO IMPROVEMENTS, AND WE DO SEE A SIMILAR LEVEL OF SERVICE B, SO THAT INDICATES TO US THAT A LOT OF THE TRAFFIC DELAYS ARE DUE TO BACKGROUND TRAFFIC AND NOT WHAT'S GOING ON SPECIFICALLY AT FOUR CORNERS.
UM, BUT MIKE, WAS THERE ANYTHING ELSE YOU WANTED TO ADD TO THAT? NO, I, I, I THINK YOU'VE FIRST NAILED IT.
IT, IT'S LESS DEVELOPMENT, DEFINITELY BE LESS TRIPS.
HOWEVER, I DON'T WANT THERE TO BE PERCEPTION THAT IF YOU REDUCE IT BY 50%, THAT'S A LINEAR ONE-TO-ONE RATIO.
WHAT HAPPENS WITH THE DELAY, THERE'S A LOT OF TRAFFIC THAT'S NOT ASSOCIATED WITH THE FOUR CORNERS THAT COMES THROUGH HERE.
LESS UNITS, DEFINITELY LESS TRAFFIC.
I DON'T WANT THERE JUST TO BE A PERCEPTION THAT NOW WE'RE LEVEL SERVICE B, EVEN IF WE DO 200 UNITS, WE'RE PROBABLY STILL IN THAT D E RANGE, GIVEN WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THE BACKGROUND TRAFFIC.
UM, AND THEN JUST TO, TO FOLLOW UP ON LANE'S POINT WITH THE REDUCTIONS, THE 10%, A LOT OF TIMES WE DON'T GO HIGHER IN 10% BECAUSE STATE D O T, IT'S THEIR ROADWAY.
THEY HAVE THEIR LIMIT TO WHAT THEY ACCEPT.
REALITY IS COULD SEE MORE THAN 10%.
UM, THEIR, UH, GUIDELINES, I I I I, I JUST WANNA POINT OUT THAT EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE AND THE LARGE BUILDINGS THAT ARE ON THERE WERE, IT WAS BEFORE ITS TIME BECAUSE IT WAS TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT PRIOR TO THAT TERM, ACTUALLY EVEN EXISTING, I BELIEVE.
UH, AND THAT'S WHY MANY OF THE BUILDINGS WERE BUILT WITH MINIMAL OR NO PARKING WHATSOEVER.
RIGHT? AND NOW WE'RE FACED WITH, UH, DURING THE WINTER TIME, PEOPLE DON'T HAVE ANY PLACE TO PARK THEIR CARS BECAUSE THEY NEED TO GET THEM OFF THE STREET.
AND THEY HAVE NOT ONLY ONE CAR, BUT SOME HAVE TWO CARS OR MORE.
AND SO WE ALSO HAVE TO BE MINDFUL, MINDFUL OF THAT.
SO, UM, I, I KNOW WHAT, THEY'RE AT THE BEGINNING OF A PROCESS AND, AND YOU'VE DONE, YOU KNOW, EXCELLENT WORK, AND I KNOW YOU'VE BEEN WORKING HARD AT, AT THIS, AND I, UH, BEEN OUT AT SOME OF THE, UH, SITE, UH, THE SITE VISITS, AND I, I SEE HOW THOROUGH YOU ARE.
UM, AND OF COURSE, WHENEVER ANYBODY THROWS OUT, YOU KNOW, LARGE NUMBERS, UM, YOU KNOW, SOMEBODY'S GONNA RAISE A QUESTION ABOUT SOMETHING.
SO IT'S, UM, IT'S, IT'S A VERY GOOD BEGINNING OF THE PROCESS, BUT NONE OF THIS GOES ANYWHERE UNLESS WE COULD ADDRESS STORM WATER.
SO I THAT'S A GREAT SEGUE TO STORM WATER
YEAH, I JUST WANTED TO ASK ONE OTHER THING.
YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, LIKE I'M A LITTLE CONCERNED THAT, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE ARE GONNA LOOK AT THE FOUR 50 NUMBER AND, UH, AND, YOU KNOW, GET ALL FREAKED OUT.
WE COULD ALSO, UM, MARKET THIS AND SAY, OKAY, WE'RE GONNA TRY SAY 50 UNITS OF ONE CORNER, UH, AND SEE THE IMPACT OF THE, I'M WONDERING IF THERE'S, WELL, THAT MIGHT BE HOW IT HAPPENS.
THE DEVELOPMENT'S NOT GONNA ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE.
AND I THINK THAT THIS IS THE STUDY THAT GIVES US PARAMETERS.
WE'RE NOT, WE CAN, WE'VE GOT TIME TO PLAN IT, RIGHT? WE DON'T, WE DON'T NEED TO MAKE THOSE DECISION.
THE, THE TOWN BOARD, YOU KNOW, ULTIMATELY HAS THE, THE ULTIMATE CONTROL HERE.
SO IF IT'S, LET'S SAY A DOWNTOWN, UH, MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT OVERLAY DISTRICT, THAT IS THE ZONING MECHANISM THAT ENABLES MIXED USE, UH, REDEVELOPMENT.
IF FOUR CORNERS, UH, THE TOWN BOARD CAN SET THE, UH, EITHER THE F A R OR THE, THE, UM, UNIT DENSITY PER ACRE.
AND IF, IF IT'S SUCH THAT THE TOWN BOARD FEELS, UM, ONLY CONFIDENT WITH, LET'S JUST SAY, UM, YOU KNOW, 50, 60 UNITS AT A CORNER, UM, THEN YOU HAVE THAT CONTROL TO SET THAT PARAMETER.
AND IF THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY RESPONDS TO THAT, THEN, UM, YOU KNOW, THEN, THEN YOU HAVE A SCENARIO WHERE YOU'RE GONNA SEE PROPOSED REDEVELOPMENT.
I JUST HAD A, THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY DEMEAN, UH, YOU KNOW, DEEMS THAT TO BE, UM, NOT OF VALUE FOR REASONABLE RETURN, THEN, YOU KNOW, YOU
[01:35:01]
WILL NOT HAVE DEVELOPERS COME UP AND TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE OVERLAY DISTRICT.SO, UM, YOU DO, I JUST WANNA STRESS THE TOWN BOARD DOES HAVE THE CONTROL, AND THESE ARE NUMBERS THAT THROUGH THE STUDY HAVE INDICATED, UM, YOU KNOW, WOULD WORK, UH, PER, YOU KNOW, THE EXPERTISE OF A K R F AND, UM, IN, IN HOW THEY FEEL.
NEW YORK STATE D O T WOULD VIEW THE INTERSECTION.
UM, BUT REALLY IT IS A STARTING POINT.
AND, UM, YOU KNOW, I THINK IT'S, IT'S VERY HELPFUL.
I JUST HAD THIS DISCUSSION, GARRETT, I JUST HAD ONE OTHER QUESTION.
DO WE HAVE THE ABILITY OF, UH, WHEN, WHEN WE'RE SAYING WE REZONING, SAY THE ENTIRE FOUR CORNERS, COULD WE TAKE LIKE A CORNER OF THE FOUR CORNERS AND SAY, OKAY, WE WANNA TEST OUT, SAY THE EAST SIDE ONE CORNER AND, AND SEE THE IMPACT AND THEN DECIDE WHETHER WE'RE GONNA, UM, UM, YOU KNOW, ALLOW, ALLOW, UH, YOU KNOW, MAXIMUM SAY, DEVELOPMENT AT THE OTHER THREE CORNERS? BECAUSE I SORT OF, I'D FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE IF, YOU KNOW, WE TRY, YOU KNOW, BEFORE YOU GIVE, GIVE THE RIGHT TO DEVELOP, YOU KNOW, ALL FOUR CORNERS THAT WE TEST OUT, ONE, SEE IF IT, IT'LL WORK, SEE WHAT THE PROBLEMS ARE.
AND THEN, AND THEN PAUL, I THINK THIS IS A MASTER PLAN, AND NO, I'M JUST ASKING, I'M, I'M ASKING A QUESTION.
IF WE HAVE ANY OPPORTUNITY TO JUST TAKE A SECTION, TOWN BOARD COULD DO NOTHING, OR THEY CAN DO ONE CORNER, THEY CAN DO FOUR.
NO, WE HAVE THE, NO, DO WE HAVE THE ABILITY OF SAYING WE, WE ARE ONLY RIGHT NOW GONNA DO ONE, ONE CORNER.
UM, IT ALL DEPENDS ON, IT'S LIKE HALF A LOAF.
YOU, YOU, YOU, QUARTER OF LOAF, YOU WOULD, I MEAN, IF THE, IF THE ZONING MECHANISM IS, LET'S SAY AS I DESCRIBED A, UH, MIXED USE DOWNTOWN REDEVELOPMENT OVERLAY DISTRICT, UM, THE TOWN BOARD WOULD HAVE THE DISCRETION TO PLACE THAT OVERLAY DISTRICT ON 1, 2, 3, OR FOUR OKAY.
UM, SO IF THE TOWN BOARD FELT IT PRUDENT TO, UH, ENACT THAT OR RE RE REMAP THE, UM, OVERLAY ONTO ONE CORNER, UM, THE TOWN BOARD HAS THE DISCRETION TO DO THAT.
AND I, I DO WANNA NOTE THAT THERE HAVE BEEN SOME QUESTIONS THAT HAVE COME IN.
DO, DO YOU, DOES THE BOARD THINK THAT IT MAKES THE MOST SENSE TO GO THROUGH THE STORM WATER TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE TIME FOR ALL THAT? OR WOULD YOU, UM, YEAH, LIKE YOU TOUCH ON, I'LL, THEY, ON THE NON STORM ORDER, ARE THEY ON THIS, THESE ARE, UH, TRAFFIC QUESTIONS? YES.
I, I THINK WE SHOULD DO IT BECAUSE WE PROMISED THEM THAT WE WOULD TAKE THEIR QUESTIONS DURING THE MEETING.
SO I WILL, UM, TOUCH ON SOME OF THE QUESTIONS.
UH, SO FIRST QUESTION, DEVELOPERS ARE BEING ASKED TO, ON A SIDEWALK ALL THE WAY UP WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE, UM, THERE ARE MASSIVE EXPENSES INCLUDED TO PAY FOR STORMWATER MANAGEMENT ASSOCIATED WITH THAT.
IS IT REALISTIC THAT THE TOWN RELIES ON A DEVELOPER TO FUND SUCH A MASSIVE ENDEAVOR? SO, UM, WHAT A K R F PRESENTED WERE A SERIES OF IMPROVEMENTS SUCH AS TURN LANES, UH, DRIVEWAY CONSOLIDATIONS, UM, BETTER SIDEWALKS ALONG THE FRONTAGE OF THE SITE.
UM, WE DID NOT PRESENT THAT, UM, A DEVELOPER WOULD BE, UM, REQUIRED TO, UH, PLACE A SIDEWALK ALL THE WAY UP WEST HARSDALE AVENUE.
THE, THE SIDEWALK UP WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE IS, UM, SOMETHING THAT THE TOWN ENDEAVORS TO BUILD VIA AN ACTIVE GRANT, WHICH WE HAVE YET TO HEAR FROM.
SO HOPEFULLY WE GET THAT GRANT.
UM, IF THE GRANT DOES NOT COME THROUGH, YES, THE TOWN WILL HAVE TO PIVOT AND FIGURE OUT OTHER WAYS TO, UM, IMPROVE PEDESTRIAN SAFETY OF WEST HARSDALE AVENUE.
YOU KNOW, COULD THAT INCLUDE, UM, YOU KNOW, THE DEVELOPER, UH, HELP PERHAPS, BUT PROBABLY MORE CONFINED TO THE FOUR CORNERS.
UM, WHAT IS THE TOWN WILLING TO OFFER A DEVELOPER TO GIVE SOME OF THEIR PROPERTY TO BECOME A TURNING LANE OR TO BECOME A POCKET PARK? WILL THE TOWN OFFER AN EXTRA FLOOR IN, IN THE EVENTUAL DEVELOPMENT? WELL, ULTIMATELY, THE OFFER IS THE POTENTIAL, THE PROSPECT FOR UPDATED ZONING TO ENABLE, UM, SOMETHING MUCH DIFFERENT THAN WHAT THE CURRENT ZONING, UH, ALLOWS.
SO THAT, THAT IS A, UH, BIG TIME INCENTIVE.
UM, SO I THINK THAT'S, THAT'S HOW I WOULD RESPOND TO THAT ONE.
HAVE YOU, UM, LOOKED AT FINANCIAL SCENARIOS THAT JUSTIFY FOUR STORIES AND NOT MORE? UM, OUR CALCULATIONS SHOW THAT A MINIMUM OF FIVE STORIES IS NEEDED TO MAKE FINANCIAL SENSE FOR A DEVELOPMENT TO BE PROFITABLE, UM, WHICH WAS SEVERAL YEARS AGO.
UM, SO ULTIMATELY, I THINK, UM, WE'RE TALKING AND WHEN WE THINK ABOUT STORIES, THAT'S AN, YOU KNOW, AN URBAN DESIGN AND A AESTHETIC, UH, TYPE CONSIDERATION.
SO WE'D WANNA BE RESPECTFUL OF, OF, OF ADJACENT PROPERTIES.
UM, I THINK THE BIGGER DRIVERS, THE UNIT COUNT, SO, UM, YOU KNOW, WE SAY FOUR STORIES.
COULD THERE BE A FIFTH RECESSED STORY PERHAPS IF IT WAS DONE SO IN A MANNER THAT IS CONSISTENT WITH, UM, NEIGHBORING SITES AND RESPECTFUL OF NEIGHBORING SITES? UM, I DO SEE A FLOODING QUESTION, WE'LL, WE'LL, WE'LL
[01:40:01]
CHECK BACK ON THAT.UM, THE TRAFFIC STUDY NEEDS TO BE REDONE POST COVID YEARS AND BEYOND ITS CURRENT BORDERS.
UH, IT'S FORESEE NOW YEARS LATER, FULLY DEFINED TO ITS BOUNDARIES.
IF NOT, WHY, UM, STOP COASTING UPON PEDESTRIAN SAFETY AS CAMOUFLAGE FOR THINGS THAT WILL GET WORSE.
UM, LET, LET ME START WITH A K R F.
UM, WHAT IS YOUR OPINION ON, UM, MUCH OF THE TRAFFIC DATA, WHICH WAS TAKEN, UH, 2019 PRE PANDEMIC? COULD YOU COMMENT ON THAT PLEASE? YEAH.
OUR TRAFFIC DATA WAS COLLECTED IN OCTOBER, 2019, SO YES, PRE PANDEMIC AND REPRESENTATIVE OF EXISTING CONDITIONS.
ONE THING I DO WANT TO NOTE IS THAT TRAFFIC LEVELS TODAY HAVE NOT YET RETURNED TO PRE PANDEMIC CONDITIONS ARE CLOSE, BUT NOT QUITE DURING PEAK HOURS, ESPECIALLY, WHICH IS WHERE WE FOCUSED OUR ANALYSIS.
SO IN THAT, UM, OUR ANALYSIS WAS CONSERVATIVE IN USING PRE PANDEMIC DATA, AND ALSO, UM, GARRETT, MAYBE THIS IS OVERSTEPPING SLIGHTLY, BUT EACH DEVELOPER WOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR OWN, UH, SITE SPECIFIC TRAFFIC IMPACT STUDIES USING NEWLY COLLECTED TRAFFIC DATA OR EVEN HISTORICAL DATA THAT'S BEEN GROWN FOR EACH OF THEIR SITES.
UM, SO THIS IS NOT THE END ALL, BE ALL, LIKE YOU'VE MENTIONED PREVIOUSLY, BUT THERE WILL BE MORE STUDIES DONE FOR FOUR CORNERS.
UM, ANOTHER QUESTION IN CALCULATING THE TRAFFIC DUE TO, UH, POTENTIAL NEW DEVELOPMENT, DID YOU FACTOR IN THE NEED FOR SCHOOL BUSES TO STOP AND PICK UP AND DROP OFF STUDENTS RESIDING IN THE NEW HOUSING UNITS? SO IN TERMS OF SCHOOL BUS DROP OFFS AND PICKUPS, UM, THESE WOULD REALLY BE FEWER VEHICLES AT THE SITE, IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT, BECAUSE ALL STUDENTS GO INTO ONE SINGLE SCHOOL BUS AS OPPOSED TO, UM, BEING PICKED UP BY A PARENT DRIVEN TO SCHOOL IN ONE VEHICLE.
UM, AT THE SOFTWARE THAT WE USE TO ANALYZE TRAFFIC, DOES NOT CONSIDER SCHOOL BUS DROP OFF IN PICKUP.
HOWEVER, UH, IT IS STILL A CONSERVATIVE ANALYSIS AND I'LL ASK MIKE TO ELABORATE ON THAT IF THERE'S ANYTHING MORE TO BE ADDED.
NO, UM, I THINK YOU CAPTURED IT.
IT DOES, IT DOES ACCOUNT FOR REGULAR BUSES THAT PULL OVER AND STOP LIKE THE
UM, SO YOU TYPICALLY DON'T SEE THEM IN A TRAFFIC STUDY.
ANOTHER QUESTION, UM, WHO WOULD FINANCE THE, UH, PARKING GARAGES? UM, THE TOWN IS NOT THE DEVELOPER.
AND, UM, YEAH, SO THAT, THAT'S WHERE YOU DO START TO THINK ABOUT, UM, RETURN ON INVESTMENT.
AND YOU THINK ABOUT PARKING SPACES AND STRUCTURED PARKING BEING UPWARDS OF, COULD BE 40, $50,000 A SPACE.
UM, YOU THINK ABOUT LAND ACQUISITION COSTS, UM, I THINK ON SOME LEVEL YOU DO WANNA BE COGNIZANT OF, UM, NOT SETTING THE, UH, DENSITY BAR TOO LOW WHERE IT'S, YOU KNOW, JUST FLAT OUT UNREALISTIC FOR, UM, ANYTHING TO HAPPEN.
UM, BUT, YOU KNOW, I JUST WANT TO CALL ATTENTION TO LIKE ANOTHER DEVELOPMENT IN THE TOWN OF GREENBURG, WHICH WE ALL KNOW THE WEST HAVE, FOR EXAMPLE.
SO THAT SITE, UM, IT IS A SMALL SITE, I BELIEVE IT'S, IT'S UNDER A HALF ACRE, UM, 28 UNITS, AND THEY WERE ABLE TO DO UNDER PARKING UNDER THE BUILDING AND THEN SOME SURFACE PARKING.
SO, UM, YOU KNOW, THE, THE FINANCES FOR THAT PROJECT WORKED OUT ALONG WITH THAT ACREAGE.
UM, SO THERE COULD BE A COMBINATION OF UNDERGROUND PARKING, SURFACE PARKING, UM, AND YES, IT ALL IS A FUNCTION OF THE DENSITY AND HAVING ADEQUATE PARKING, BUT INDEED PARKING, STRUCTURED PARKING IS, IS, IS NOT INEXPENSIVE.
UM, THE POINT WELL TAKEN, UM, D O T IS NOT BACKED TURN LANES, THEY'LL ONLY GO ALONG WITH THE LESS COSTLY PEDESTRIAN SAFETY ISSUES.
SO, UM, A Q F, COULD YOU COMMENT ON, UM, YOUR EXPERIENCE WITH PRIVATE PROPOSALS OR PROPOSALS TO ADD TURN LANES, UH, FOR THE PURPOSES OF, UM, ENABLING BETTER TRAFFIC EFFICIENCY? YEAH, OF COURSE.
UH, WHEN WE DID MEET WITH D O T, THEY WERE SUPPORTIVE OF THESE TURN LANES.
UM, AND THEY, THEY DID SUPPORT THE IDEA OF ADDING TURN LANES AT EV AT ALL THE LOCATIONS WE HAD SUGGESTED.
AND IN TERMS OF DEVELOPERS BEING TIED TO TURN LANES.
UM, WHAT I WANTED TO MENTION BEFORE WAS THAT, UH, TURN LANES COULD POTENTIALLY BE A REQUIRED MITIGATION FOR DEVELOPERS TO IMPLEMENT FOR EACH OF THEIR SITES.
UM, SO IN THE PAST WE HAVE SEEN DEVELOPERS, UH, IMPLEMENT THESE SITE SPECIFIC MITIGATIONS, INCLUDING TURN LANES AND OTHER ROADWAY IMPROVEMENTS.
SO I DON'T BELIEVE THIS IS SOMETHING THE TOWN WOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR, OR D O T FOR THAT MATTER.
UH, THE DEVELOPER WOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR PAYING FOR THIS, UH, ONE OR TWO MORE THEN I THINK WE, WE SHOULD TRANSITION TO, UM, UH, STORMWATER.
UH, WHEN YOU BUILD AN APARTMENT BUILDING
[01:45:01]
OR APARTMENT BUILDINGS AT THE FOUR CORNERS AND, UH, YOU HAVE CALLS FOR AMBULANCE AND FIRE TRUCKS, TWO FIRE TRUCKS SHOW UP AT THOSE BUILDINGS, UM, YOU WILL SHUT DOWN CENTRAL AVENUE AND EAST OR WEST HARTSDALE AVENUE FOR, UH, AT LEAST 20 MINUTES, UM, WHICH COULD HAPPEN ON A REGULAR BASIS.UM, SO YEAH, UM, GREAT CONSIDERATION.
AND, UM, THE SITE DEVELOPMENT, THE SITE DESIGN FOR ANY BUILDING WILL ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO HAVE OFF STREET, UM, EMERGENCY LANES.
UM, THESE SITES HAVE TO HAVE, UH, LOADING UNLOADING SO THAT THERE'S SO MANY FACTORS THAT GO INTO, UH, WHAT HAVE TO HA WHAT HAS TO OCCUR, UM, WITHIN THE PRIVATE DEVELOPMENT.
AND, UM, AND THAT'S WHERE STRUCTURED PARKING REALLY ALLOWS YOU, UM, TO COMPACT YOUR DEVELOPMENT AND, UM, AND REALLY MAKE BEST USE OF THE SITE.
SO, 'CAUSE THERE'S A LOT OF INPUTS, IT'S NOT JUST BUILDINGS AND DRIVEWAYS, UH, AND LOADING AREAS.
IT'S, IT'S THINGS LIKE LANDSCAPING AND BUFFERS TO BE RESPECTFUL OF ADJACENT AREAS.
UM, YET COULD THERE BE SCENARIOS WHERE, UM, AN EMERGENCY VEHICLE NEEDS TO BE, UH, OUT IN FRONT OF A BUILDING? UH, ABSOLUTELY CANNOT RULE THAT OUT.
UM, BUT WITH GOOD DESIGN, I THINK, UM, THAT WOULD NOT BE THE NORM.
UM, AND DOING THE, IT'S ALSO COMMON, SORRY, GO AHEAD.
IN DOING THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, UH, WE WERE LOOKING AT THE POTENTIAL FOR A TOTAL REDO OF THE CORNERS.
AND AS PART OF ONE OF THOSE TOTAL REDOS, WHICH IS WHAT THEY'RE CONSIDERING HERE, UH, HARTSDALE FIRE DEPARTMENT WOULD COME OUT OF THE FIREHOUSE AND GO STRAIGHT ACROSS, AND THAT WOULD BE A LANE TO GET AROUND THE FOUR CORNERS AREA.
SO THE FOUR CORNERS AREA WAS BLOCKED, THEY WOULD STILL HAVE ACCESS TO THE BUILDINGS ON EAST HARSDALE AVENUE.
YOU KNOW, THESE ARE ALL THINGS THAT HAVE TO GET WORKED OUT AND THE, UH, PLANNING PROCESS FOR A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN FOR THAT, THOSE, THOSE CORNERS.
SO THO THOSE KIND OF DISCUSSIONS HAVE BEEN HAD, UH, AND THEY'RE VERY GOOD ONES, AND I WOULD HOPE THAT IT DOESN'T HAPPEN FREQUENTLY ON EAST HILL AVENUE, THAT THE FIRE TRUCKS ARE THERE AND, AND RESPONDING, UM, AND, UH, TYING UP TRAFFIC AND, UH, BUT THOSE ARE THINGS THAT HAVE TO BE ADDRESSED.
AND I MEAN, IF EVERYTHING LINES UP AND THERE'S ZONING THAT PUTS OUT, YOU KNOW, A DENSITY THAT THE BOARD IS, IS COMFORTABLE WITH AND RESPECTFUL OF NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES AND, AND MEETS ACCEPTABLE TRAFFIC LEVELS, UM, IF ALL THOSE THINGS LINE UP, YOU'RE REALLY TALKING ABOUT, I CANNOT STRESS ENOUGH HOW IMPORTANT IT IS TO HAVE, YOU KNOW, AN ENGINEER AND AN ARCHITECT TEAM THAT REALLY CAN, UM, THINK INTENSELY ABOUT THAT SITE AND DESIGN IT IN A WAY THAT, UM, YOU KNOW, REALLY SPEAKS TO WHAT THE FOUR CORNERS REDEVELOPMENT TALKS ABOUT, YOU KNOW, ATTRACTIVE BUILDINGS THAT, YOU KNOW, MAKE SENSE AND, AND ARE IN THE CONTEXT OF THE CORNER THAT THEY'RE ON.
UM, SO, UH, I JUST THINK THAT THE, THE PROFESSIONAL ARCHITECT ENGINEER, UM, YOU KNOW, HAS, HAS, HAS A LOT OF WORK TO DO IN THIS EQUATION, BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, I THINK THESE ARE, UM, DESIGN CONSIDERATIONS THAT CAN BE MET AND I FEEL LIKE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE JUST SETTING FORTH A PATH WHERE WE'RE ENABLING THAT POSSIBILITY.
WHAT I'D RECOMMEND, UM, IS THAT WE TURN IT OVER TO, UH, JUSTIN CINI TO WALK US THROUGH A LOT OF THE, THE STORM WATER AND, UH, FLOODING, MITIGATION, UH, CONSIDERATIONS THAT WE SHOULD BE THINKING ABOUT.
CAN EVERYONE HEAR ME OKAY? YES.
I'M A LICENSED PROFESSIONAL ENGINEER, UH, AND A VICE PRESIDENT HERE WITH A K R F.
UM, WE'VE BEEN WORKING, UH, WITH GARRETT AND THE ENTIRE, UH, TOWN STAFF FOR QUITE A WHILE NOW, UM, IN, IN IDENTIFYING, UM, THE EXISTING CONDITIONS AT FOUR CORNERS, UM, AND REALLY THE, THE, THE GREATER WATERSHED, UM, AND, UM, IDENTIFYING MEASURES, UM, TO KIND OF HELP RELIEVE, UH, ISSUES OF FREQUENT FLOODING AND, AND ALSO WITH AN EYE TOWARDS, UH, HOW TO MITIGATE KIND OF THE LARGER EVENTS.
UM, SO JUST A QUICK OVERVIEW ABOUT WHAT WE'LL, WE'LL DISCUSS IN OUR PRESENTATION.
AND I, I WILL TRY MY BEST TO BE BRIEF 'CAUSE I KNOW WE ARE TIGHT ON TIME.
UM, AND WE DEFINITELY WANNA SAVE TIME FOR QUESTIONS.
SO, UM, WE'RE, WE'RE GONNA DO A, A QUICK OVERVIEW OF, OF WHAT EXISTING CONDITIONS ARE LIKE HERE AT FOUR CORNERS, UM, WHAT'S KIND OF DRIVING A LOT OF THE DRAINAGE ISSUES THAT ARE, UH, OCCURRING UNDER EXISTING CONDITIONS.
UM, TALK ABOUT SOME OPTIONS THAT ARE KIND OF, UM, UH, NEAR TERM, IF YOU WILL, OR, OR KIND OF INTERIM STEPS THAT CAN BE EMPLOYED TO, TO PROVIDE RELIEF.
UM, THE, THE EVENT THAT WE'VE, UH, CHOSEN AS THE ANALYSIS POINT FOR THAT IS TWO YEAR STORM.
WE CAN TALK MORE ABOUT HOW WE GOT THERE, UM,
[01:50:01]
A LITTLE LATER IN THE PRESENTATION.UM, TALK ABOUT THE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM MITIGATION OPTION, WHICH I THINK IN LIGHT OF IDA IS, IS A MUCH MORE KIND OF TOP OF MIND, UH, UH, EVENT FOR, FOR FOLKS IN THE COMMUNITY AND, AND THEN THE TOWN.
UM, AND THEN AS WELL TALK ABOUT SOME KIND OF, UH, NEAR TERM STRATEGIES OR, OR KIND OF SAID MORE PLAINLY SOME LOW HANGING FRUIT THAT, THAT MIGHT BE ABLE TO, UH, BE IMPLEMENTED, UM, IN THE INTERIM OF EITHER OF THESE TYPES OF OPTIONS, UM, THAT CAN PROVIDE REAL, UM, BENEFITS, UH, TO PROPERTY OWNERS IN TERMS OF, OF DAMAGE EXPERIENCED, UM, DURING SOME OF THESE STORM EVENTS.
UM, SO WE'LL JUST START WITH A KIND OF A HIGH LEVEL OVERVIEW OF, UM, OF WHAT'S CALLED HARTSDALE BROOK.
AND I THINK MOST FOLKS WOULD SAY THAT THEY PROBABLY HAVEN'T SEEN A BROOK RUNNING THROUGH THIS AREA, WHICH IS JUST TRUE.
UM, AND WE'LL SHOW A LITTLE BIT OF HOW WE GOT THERE IN A MINUTE.
UM, BUT, BUT FOUR CORNERS AND, AND QUITE A BIT OF, UH, GREENBERG, UM, IS ALL CONTRIBUTORY TO WHERE THE BRONX RIVER, JUST ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE TRAIN TRACKS OVER HERE.
UM, ALL IT'S ABOUT, ALL IN ALL, IT'S ABOUT A 850 ACRE DRAINAGE AREA.
UM, ABOUT 200 TO 250 ACRES OF THAT DRAINAGE AREA, UH, DRAINS THROUGH INFRASTRUCTURE HERE AT FOUR CORNERS, AND ANOTHER ABOUT 500 OR SO ACRES DRAINS TO THE POND HERE ON THE GOLF COURSE.
ULTIMATELY, ALL OF THAT FLOW IS ROUTED AND WE WILL SHOW YOU IN A SEC, UH, TO INFRASTRUCTURE THAT RUNS BEHIND THESE BUILDINGS, UH, ON THE WEST SIDE OF EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE.
UM, SO IT'S, IT'S NOT AN INSIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF FLOW AND, AND AS YOU KNOW, AS MOST PEOPLE HAVE, UH, SEEN THE AREA KNOW THERE'S NOT AN EXISTING KIND OF WELL-DEFINED WATERCOURSE TO, UM, TO CONVEY IT, UM, WHICH HASN'T ALWAYS BEEN THE CASE.
SO, UM, AGAIN, IN, IN THE VEIN OF KIND OF STEPPING BACK AND KIND OF SEEING HOW WE GOT HERE, UM, WE TOOK A LOOK AT SOME KIND OF HISTORICAL, UH, AERIALS AND HISTORICAL TOPOGRAPHIC MAPS PREPARED BY THE U S G S AERIALS FROM WESTCHESTER COUNTY, UH, AROUND THE TURN OF LAST CENTURY.
UM, YOU COULD SEE HERE THERE WAS KIND OF A WELL-DEFINED STREAM THAT DID RUN ALONG EAST HARTSDALE, UM, AND CENTRAL AVENUE TO A DEGREE.
YOU CAN KIND OF SEE IT HERE IN THE AERIAL AS WELL.
UM, BY THE MIDDLE OF THE 19 HUNDREDS, UH, OR THE, UM, YOU KIND OF START TO SEE THAT LEGS OF THAT STREAM, UH, DISAPPEAR.
YOU START TO SEE, UH, THE FIRST BUILDINGS START TO POP UP HERE ON EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE.
UM, THE STREAM WAS STILL AN OPEN CHANNEL AT THAT POINT.
YOU CAN KIND OF STILL SEE THE REMNANTS OF THAT OPEN CHANNEL IN THE REAR YARDS OF THESE THREE BUILDINGS HERE.
UM, AND THEN BY THE SIXTIES OR SEVENTIES, UH, BOTH FROM AN AERIAL STANDPOINT AND FROM THE U S G S STANDPOINT, YOU CAN KIND OF SEE, UH, THAT STREAM KIND OF DISAPPEAR FROM THE MAP.
UM, AND THAT'S COMBINED WITH SIGNIFICANT, UH, DEVELOPMENT THAT HAS HAPPENED ALONG EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE.
UM, AND, AND LIKE WE'LL TALK ABOUT IN A MINUTE, UH, YOU KNOW, PRETTY EXTENSIVE CULVERT AND BEARING OF THAT STREAM IN, IN PIPES, WHICH ARE, UM, YOU KNOW, QUITE FRANKLY JUST SUBSTANDARD.
UM, SO, SO THIS IS HOW WATER FLOWS THROUGH FOUR CORNERS, AGAIN ABOUT THAT 250, UH, ACRES OF DRAINAGE AREA COMES TO A SERIES OF PIPES AND CULVERTS HERE IN CENTRAL AVENUE.
UM, YOU'LL PROBABLY HEAR ME REFERENCE THE FOUNTAIN DINER AND STARBUCKS QUITE A BIT, MOSTLY THE FOUNTAIN DINER, 'CAUSE THAT'S KIND OF WHERE THE BRUNT OF THE IMPACT HAPPENS AT FOUR CORNERS WHEN THERE ARE, UH, YOU KNOW, HEAVY RAINFALL EVENTS AND EVEN, YOU KNOW, MODERATE FROM A, FROM A STORMWATER STANDPOINT, UH, RAINFALL EVENTS.
SO ABOUT 250 ACRES IS PASSED THROUGH THESE PIPES, GOES INTO THESE KIND OF POORLY DEFINED, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD, CHANNELS ON THE GOLF COURSE PROPERTY.
UM, ANOTHER ABOUT, LIKE I SAID, 500 ACRES DRAINS TO THIS GOLF COURSE POND, ANOTHER LOW FLOW CHANNEL, AND IT ALL KIND OF CONVERGES HERE BEHIND THESE BUILDINGS.
AND THERE'S A SERIES OF CULVERTS THAT RUN UNDERNEATH THESE PARKING LOTS AND ACTUALLY UNDERNEATH THE BUILDINGS, UM, IT OUTLETS AGAIN INTO AN OPEN CHANNEL LIKE WE TALKED ABOUT FROM THOSE BUILDINGS BUILT IN, IN AROUND THE FORTIES OR THIRTIES.
UM, AND THEN AGAIN, BACK INTO THESE TWIN 48 INCH CULVERTS, UM, AND THEN INTO A BOX CULVERT BEFORE IT ULTIMATELY DISCHARGES UNDERNEATH THE TRAIN TRACKS TO THE OTHER SIDE OF THE BRONX RIVER.
UM, SO THESE 48 INCH CULVERTS REALLY SERVE AS, AS, AS THE PINCH POINT IN THE SYSTEM, THE KIND OF BOTTLENECK IN THE WHOLE SYSTEM AND, AND, AND, UM, IS WHAT CAUSES THE MAJORITY OF
[01:55:01]
THE BACKUP THAT HAPPENS.SO WATER'S TRYING TO GET THROUGH THESE 48 INCH CULVERTS.
IT CAN'T MAKE IT SO IT KIND OF BACKS UP AND FLOODS OUT THE GOLF COURSE.
UH, SAME DEAL IN THIS OPEN CHANNEL HERE.
IT'LL TRY AND GET INTO THAT 48 INCH CULVERT.
AND, AND, AND SIMILARLY, UH, WE'LL BACK UP AND START TO INUNDATE AREAS OF THESE BUILDINGS, AND I'VE GOT SOME MAPS IN A SECOND THAT I'LL SHOW YOU THAT KIND OF, THAT KIND OF, UM, VISUALLY DEPICT, UM, WHAT I THINK MANY PEOPLE HAVE EXPERIENCED, UH, OVER THE YEARS IN TERMS OF FLOODING, INUNDATION.
UM, THE CAPACITY OF THOSE 48 INCH CULVERTS IS ABOUT 130 C F SS.
I KNOW NOT A VERY INTUITIVE METRIC, UM, BUT JUST TO PROVIDE SOME KIND OF RELATIVE SCOPE TO THAT, UM, FOR A TWO YEAR STORM WITH THE AMOUNT OF FLOW THAT A TWO YEAR STORM, THOSE PIPES HAVE ABOUT THE CAPACITY TO PASS ABOUT A QUARTER OF IT, RIGHT? AND THEN ONCE YOU START GETTING INTO THOSE A HUNDRED YEAR EVENTS, UM, THE FLOW VERY MUCH DWARFS THE AVAILABLE CAPACITY IN THAT SYSTEM.
SO, UM, YOU KNOW, JUST IN SHORT, THE TAKEAWAY HERE IS THIS IS OUR REAL KIND OF PROBLEM AREA AND WHAT, WHAT WE KIND OF SEEK TO ADDRESS.
UM, SO AS PART OF OUR EXISTING CONDITIONS ANALYSIS, UM, I SHOULD, I'VE STATED FROM THIS TOP THAT HARTSDALE BROOK IS NOT CONSIDERED A, UH, KIND OF A FEMA OFFICIALLY MAPPED FLOODPLAIN IN THE WAY THAT OTHER KIND OF, UH, WATER COURSES IN THE REGION ARE LIKE THE BRONX RIVER OR THE SPRAIN OR, OR WHAT HAVE YOU.
BUT, UM, WE DID, UH, COMPLETE AN EFFORT TO UNDERSTAND UNDER THE DIFFERENT STORM EVENTS, WHERE ARE WE STARTING TO SEE INUNDATION, UH, WHERE ARE WE STARTING TO SEE, UH, BACKUP, WHAT IS DRIVING THESE, THESE IMPACTS? UM, AND, AND IN ADDITION, WHAT WE'VE TRIED TO ALSO DO IS KIND OF, UM, KIND OF CALIBRATE THIS ANALYSIS WITH INPUT, UH, FROM THE, THE, THE COMMUNITIES PROPERTY OWNERS IN THESE AREAS.
AND, AND, AND, AND WHAT WE'RE SEEING, UM, IN OUR MODEL IN TERMS OF, UM, AND I'LL SEE IF I CAN ZOOM IN, UM, YOU KNOW, BACKUP BEHIND THESE BUILDINGS ON EAST HARTSDALE BACKUP, UM, IN THE REARS OF, OF THESE OTHER EAST HARTSDALE BUILDINGS IS VERY MUCH CONSISTENT WITH, UM, KIND OF THE, THE LIVED EXPERIENCE, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD, OF THESE, THESE PROPERTY OWNERS.
UM, SO TO THAT END, UM, WE RECOGNIZE THAT THAT, UM, THERE'S A NEED TO ADDRESS CONVEYANCE.
UM, IF WE GO BACK TO THAT KIND OF PINCH POINT ANALOGY, UM, WE'RE, WE'RE AT A VERY SMALL AMOUNT OF CAPACITY GIVEN THE FLOW THAT, THAT WE'RE EXPERIENCING, UM, TO SOLVE THAT A HUNDRED YEAR EVENT TO SOLVE THAT, THAT ULTIMATE STORM THAT IS ON THE KIND OF THE, UM, THE SCOPE OF A IDA, UM, IS QUITE A, QUITE AN UNDERTAKING.
AND, AND WE'LL, I'LL SHOW YOU SOME, UH, SLIDES ON, ON WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE IN A MINUTE.
UM, IN THE INTERIM, THERE ARE OPPORTUNITIES THAT CAN REALLY PROVIDE RELIEF FOR THIS TWO YEAR STORM EVENT.
UM, THAT TWO YEAR STORM EVENT, AGAIN, IS ABOUT THREE AND A HALF INCHES IN A 24 HOUR PERIOD.
UM, JUST FOR SOME KIND OF, UH, RELATIVE, UM, UH, PERSPECTIVE OF WHAT THAT IS.
I MEAN, IN, IN, IN MANY YEARS, THREE AND A HALF INCHES WOULD BE THE MOST AMOUNT OF RAINFALL THAT FELL IN A 24 HOUR PERIOD, UM, FOR THE YEAR.
UM, IN OTHER YEARS, IT'S, UM, UM, YOU KNOW, DWARFED BY LARGER STORMS, MUCH LIKE IN 2021 OR 2007.
UM, BUT THE, THE AIM HERE IS THAT, UM, WE ARE PROVIDING OPTIONS THAT CAN, UH, PROVIDE SOME AMOUNT OF RELIEF FOR THOSE TWO YEARS EVENTS SO THAT THOSE, THESE KIND OF FREQUENT, UM, INSTANCES OF, UM, INUNDATION, UM, CAN BE LESSENED, UM, THEIR FREQUENCY OF CAN BE LESSENED, UM, WHILE ACKNOWLEDGING THAT, UM, THOSE SOLUTIONS DO NOT ELIMINATE VULNERABILITY TO LARGER EVENTS.
UM, AND THE ONLY WAY TO GET THERE IS, IS KIND OF WITH A MUCH BIGGER FIX.
SO, UM, KIND OF LOOKING AT THIS KIND OF IN STAGES, IF YOU WILL.
UM, SO CENTRAL AVENUE, UM, AGAIN, I, I SAID I'D MENTIONED FOUR CORNERS QUITE A BIT.
YOU'VE GOT FOUR CORNERS, I MEAN, SORRY, UH, FOUNTAIN DINER, UH, ABOUT STARBUCKS, UM, AND THE FURNITURE STORE, UM, AGAIN, THE TWO YEAR FLOW OF THAT 200 OR SO ACRES IS ABOUT 200 C F S.
THE EXISTING CAPACITY OF THE SYSTEM IS ABOUT HALF THAT.
UM, AND THE OTHER CHALLENGE THAT WE'RE DEALING WITH HERE IS JUST IS, IS A TOPOGRAPHICAL CHALLENGE.
SO, UM, FROM AN ELEVATION STANDPOINT, UM, THIS ELEVATION'S AT ABOUT 1 76.
UH, THE WATER LEVEL IN THE GOLF COURSE POND IS AROUND 1 76.
THE WATER LEVEL DOWN BY THE, THE PARKING GARAGE, UM, ON THE KIND OF, UH, EASTERN SIDE OF EAST HARTSDALE
[02:00:01]
IS AROUND 1 76.THERE'S VERY LITTLE KIND OF TOPOGRAPHY TO KIND OF BRIDGE THE, UM, THE WATERCOURSE, UM, FROM POINT A TO POINT B.
UM, SO AGAIN, WE TOOK A LOOK AT EXISTING CONDITIONS, KIND OF LOOKED AT IT AGAINST WHAT WE'VE SEEN OUT IN THE FIELD HISTORICALLY.
UM, IN TERMS OF BACKUP, THIS IS A PHOTO HERE AT THIS HEAD WALL BEHIND, UH, STARBUCKS.
UM, AND, AND HERE'S AN EXCERPT FROM THE COMPUTER MODEL THAT WE RAN, UH, WITH A SOFTWARE CALLED STORM CAD, WHICH IS, UM, A, UM, A COMPUTER AIDED, UH, SOFTWARE THAT ALLOWS TO KIND OF MODEL, UH, THE HYDRAULICS WITHIN A PIPE NETWORK.
UM, THE, THE SIMPLE TAKEAWAY IS THE, THE BLUE IS, UH, A REPRESENTATIVE OF THE WATER SURFACE ELEVATION THAT WOULD BE EXPERIENCED.
AND AS YOU CAN SEE, UM, YOU KNOW, WHAT OUR MODEL IS SAYING IS, IS VERY CONSISTENT WITH WHAT WE'VE, WE'VE SEEN EXPERIENCED, WHICH IS UNDER EXISTING CONDITIONS, EVEN IF ALL OF THESE PIPES WERE TOTALLY CLEANED OUT, WHICH WE KNOW THEY'RE NOT, UM, YOU WOULD START TO SEE BACKUP HERE AT THE FOUNTAIN DINER BACKUP HERE AT THE ENTRANCE TO STARBUCKS.
UM, AND, AND A, A SIGNIFICANT, UM, AMOUNT OF FLOW AND BACKUP COMING OUT OF HERE, UM, AT THE HEAD WALL, WHICH ULTIMATELY DISCHARGES ONTO THE GOLF COURSE PROPERTY.
UM, SO THE FIRST SOLUTION TO ADDRESS THAT, THAT, AGAIN, THOSE, THOSE, UM, FROM A STORMWATER STANDPOINT, RELATIVELY SMALL, BUT AGAIN, THREE AND A HALF INCHES IN A 24 HOUR PERIOD IS STILL QUITE AN EVENT.
UM, UM, A SERIES OF BOX CULVERTS, UM, IN THAT SIMILAR ALIGNMENT THAT COULD, UM, UH, CONVEY THAT STORMWATER AND JUST KIND OF GET IT OUT OF THE, UH, FOUR CORNERS INTERSECTION.
UM, THE PROS TO THIS IS, UH, THAT IT IS, UM, LIKE I SAID EARLIER, AN IMPROVEMENT THAT CAN BE READILY, UH, ENACTED TO PROVIDE REAL-TIME RELIEF, UM, FOR THESE FREQUENT EVENTS.
UM, THE CON LIKE I'VE SAID IS, AND, AND THIS'LL BE A, A COMMON THEME, IS THAT EVEN WITH THIS SOLUTION, THOSE LARGER STORM EVENTS STILL PREVENT PRESENT, UH, LEVELS OF VULNERABILITY.
WHAT'S THE COST OF THAT? UH, YEAH, ESTIMATED REQUEST, UH, THE ORDER OF MAGNITUDE, AND AGAIN, WE, WE'VE DONE ONLY VERY CONCEPTUAL LEVEL DESIGNS FOR THIS, BUT THE ORDER OF MAGNITUDE WAS IN, IN AROUND THE FOUR OR $5 MILLION RANGE, I BELIEVE.
UM, FOR, FOR, FOR OPTION, FOR OPTION ONE, THIS WOULD BE TEMPORARY FIX.
THE TEMPORARY FIX IS FOR MILLION
UH, SAY THAT ONE MORE TIME, I'M SORRY.
NO, I'M SAYING THIS TWO YEAR RELIEF EFFORT THAT YOU, THAT YOU SAID ISN'T REALLY GONNA SOLVE THE PROBLEM, THAT'S A FOUR, FOUR OR $5 MILLION BUDGET ITEM, CORRECT? CORRECT.
IT'S STILL, LISTEN, IT'S STILL A CONSIDERABLE AMOUNT OF WORK.
UM, YOU KNOW, IT'S, IT'S QUITE A BIT OF INFRASTRUCTURE, BUT WE ARE ALSO DEALING WITH QUITE A BIT OF FLOW.
UM, CAN YOU DEFINE BOX CULVERT? UH, BOX CULVERT IS JUST A RECTANGULAR STRUCTURE.
UM, IT'S, IT'S A, UM, IT'S ESSENTIALLY A PIPE, BUT, UM, IT'S SQUARE OR RECTANGULAR.
UM, IT GIVES, LIKE I HAD SAID EARLIER, THERE'S UM, VERY LITTLE ELEVATION CHANGE BETWEEN WHERE THE FOUNTAIN DINER SITS, UM, AND WHERE THE DISCHARGE POINT IS ON THE GOLF COURSE AND WHERE IT ULTIMATELY CONNECTS INTO THAT EAST HARTSDALE SYSTEM.
UM, SO THE ONLY WAY TO KIND OF MOVE THAT WATER IS TO GO VERY LOW AND FAIRLY WIDE.
UM, THERE, THERE AREN'T REALLY OPTIONS FOR KIND OF BIG CIRCULAR PIPES BECAUSE THE, UM, 'CAUSE OF THE ELEVATION CONSTRAINTS.
SO THAT'S WHY YOU'RE SEEING SOMETHING THAT IS ESSENTIALLY, IT'S A SERIES OF TWIN BOX CULVERTS, WHICH MEANS KIND OF A DOUBLE BARREL SYSTEM ONLY KIND OF 30 INCHES TALL, ALMOST, YOU KNOW, ABOUT 10 FOOT WIDE.
SO AGAIN, UM, BECAUSE OF THE ELEVATION CONSTRAINTS, THE, THE WAY TO KIND OF ATTACK THIS IS TO KIND OF GO WITH SOMETHING THAT'S FAIRLY LOW PROFILE, BUT PROVIDES A FAIRLY WIDE, UM, CHANNEL.
I KNOW THAT THE FEDERAL AND STATE GOVERNMENT IS TRYING TO ADDRESS, YOU KNOW, INFRASTRUCTURE AND, AND UH, FLOODING ISSUES.
AND I'M WONDERING, ARE YOU AWARE OF, UM, YOU KNOW, FEDERAL OR STATE GRANTS THAT, UM, WOULD HELP, UM, REDUCE THE COST? PAUL, I'M LOOKING AT, RIGHT.
UM, THE DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION HAS ANY NUMBER OF GRANTS, AND THIS ONE IN PARTICULAR IS THE NATIONAL CULVERT REMOVAL, REPLACEMENT AND RESTORATION PROGRAM TO PROVIDE SUPPLEMENTAL FUNDING FOR GRANTS TO A STATE LOCAL GOVERNMENT.
SO THERE ARE GRANTS, UM, THIS IS NOT YET OUT THERE, BUT THERE, THERE ARE A COUPLE OF MORE TOO, THAT HAVE TO DO WITH ROAD WORK AND RIGHT.
SO THERE ARE PLENTY ON A FEDERAL LEVEL, AND CERTAINLY SOME IN STATES.
SO THIS IS REALLY, UH, SOMETHING THAT'S REALLY MANAGEABLE
[02:05:01]
BECAUSE IF WE APPLY FOR A FEDERAL OR STATE GRANT, YOU KNOW, OUR CONTRIBUTION COULD BE REALLY AFFORDABLE.UM, SAY WHAT WE HAVE TO DO TO GET THE GRANT.
IT, IT, IT'S, THIS IS JUST AN OVERVIEW OF, OF GRANTS.
THEY DON'T HAVE, UM, THEY DON'T HAVE REAL DETAIL IN IT AS YET.
IT'S JUST THIS IS WHAT'S COMING FOR, FOR THE TOWN BOARD.
WE'RE GONNA SPEAK TO GRANT OPPORTUNITIES, UH, IN A BIT.
SO, SO WE'LL, WE'LL FOLLOW UP WITH THAT AFTER THIS, UH, THIS PORTION OF THE PRESENTATION.
UM, SO AGAIN, JUST, UM, OUT, YOU KNOW, WE, WE RAN THIS SCENARIO THROUGH THE, THROUGH THE MODELING SOFTWARE.
UM, AND ULTIMATELY WHAT, WHAT YOU START TO SEE, AGAIN, THAT BLUE LINE REPRESENTING THAT WATER SURFACE ELEVATION IS KIND OF SAFE CONVEYANCE OF THAT TWO YEAR STORM EVENT.
UM, OBVIOUSLY PROVIDING A BENEFIT AS COMPARED TO EXISTING CONDITIONS FOR THOSE LARGER YEAR STORM EVENTS.
UM, PART OF THE REASON THAT WE, AND I'M JUST GONNA SLIDE BACK A FEW SLIDES, SO I APOLOGIZE.
PART OF THE REASON THAT WE LOOKED AT THAT TWO YEAR STORM EVENT AS THE BASELINE IS, IS, IS IN THIS 10 YEAR STORM, WHICH IS GONNA BE ON THE RIGHT.
UM, THE BACKUP THAT HAPPENS HERE AT FOUR CORNERS IS MORE REALLY A FUNCTION OF THAT PINCH POINT.
SO THE WATER IS REALLY, YOU KNOW, THERE, THERE'S, THERE'S VERY LITTLE YOU COULD DO HERE JUST AT FOUR CORNERS TO KIND OF GET THE WATER OUT WITHOUT DOING EXTENSIVE DOWNSTREAM IMPROVEMENTS TO THIS INFRASTRUCTURE BEHIND THE BUILDINGS.
YOU COULD PUT, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD PUT SIX BARRELS OF PIPES IN INSTEAD OF TWO.
UM, AND, AND THE DRIVING FACTOR WOULD BE THAT BACKUP OF THE, THE FLOW FROM THE, UM, FROM THE, UH, PINCH POINT HERE.
SO THAT'S WHY THE TWO, IT SEEMS TO ME, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT, THAT WE HAVE TO ADDRESS THE GARBAGE AND DEBRIS THAT'S COLLECTED IN THESE, IN THESE CULVERTS AS WELL.
YOU KNOW, THE GARBAGE AND DEBRIS IRRESPECTIVE THE PIPES ARE TOO SMALL.
SO HAVE YOU BEEN ABLE TO ASCERTAIN WHAT DEGREE THE GARBAGE AND DEBRIS THAT IS CURRENTLY CLOGGING THESE PIPES EXACERBATES, UH, THE, THE, THE DAMAGE? YES.
I MEAN, WE KNOW THAT, UM, WE, WE'VE DONE AN EXTENSIVE AMOUNT OF, OF KIND OF TV INSPECTING OF THESE DIFFERENT LINES, UM, UH, IN TANDEM WITH SOME OF THE CENTRAL LAB SIDEWALK WORK THAT HAS HAPPENED, UH, IN THE RECENT, IN THE RECENT MONTHS, UM, HAVE BEEN ABLE TO OBSERVE BLOCKAGES AND DEBRIS.
UM, THE ANALYSIS IS, THE ANALYSIS THAT WE'VE COMPLETED ARE ALL KIND OF ASSUMING THAT, UH, THE PIPES ARE CLEAN AND CLEAR, UM, AS A BASELINE BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, THAT'S A REASONABLE POINT TO GET TO.
UM, AND, AND ALONGSIDE, UM, RICH FUND FROM D B W AND GARRETT, WE'VE ALL KIND OF HAD DISCUSSIONS ABOUT THE BEST FRAMEWORK TO ENACT MAINTENANCE OF THESE LINES TO ENSURE THAT THEY'RE CLEA CLEAN AND CLEAR, BOTH FROM THE PROPERTY OWNER STANDPOINT AND FROM D O T.
UM, SO WE'RE, WE'RE AWARE OF THE, THE BLOCKAGES.
UM, WE'RE AWARE OF SOME CORRECTIVE ACTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN OVER THE COURSE OF THE LAST SEVERAL YEARS.
UM, I KNOW THERE'S A CONCRETE, UH, BLOCKAGE DOWN HERE AT THE PARKING AUTHORITY.
I KNOW THERE'S A PIPE HERE THAT WAS, UM, YOU KNOW, CROSSING THE CENTRAL AVENUE THAT WAS PRETTY EXTENSIVELY CLOGGED.
UM, SO IT'S, IT'S, IT'S SLOWLY BEING ADDRESSED.
UM, BUT I THINK, YOU KNOW, UH, THE, THE FRAMEWORK FOR CONTINUED MAINTENANCE OF THOSE IS, IS, IS JUST AS IMPORTANT AS ANY DESIGN SOLUTION.
BUT IS IT FAIR TO SAY THAT ONE SHOULD BEGIN BY CLEANING EVERYTHING OUT? YES.
UM, SO AGAIN, UH, THIS SOLUTION, UM, AGAIN, WE PROVIDE FOR THAT.
I JUST, IF I COULD COMMENT, UH, I THINK THAT'S BEING DONE AS WE FOUND THE PIPE ON CENTRAL AVENUE THAT YOU POINTED TO THAT WAS ALMOST ENTIRELY BLOCKED WITH DEBRIS, UH, RIGHT.
WE, WE ARE TAKING, UH, CORRECTIVE ACTION AND AS YOU ME, YOU MENTIONED THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY, THEY'RE PUTTING THE, THE, THE SCOPE DOWN THE CAMERA DOWN TO TAKE A LOOK AT THAT MM-HMM.
UM, BUT IT'S, IT'S, UH, YOU COULD CLEAN IT OUT TODAY AND IT COULD BE CLOGGED TOMORROW.
BUT BECAUSE IT'S ALL COMING DOWN FROM RIDGE ROAD, YOU KNOW MM-HMM.
SO THERE'S NO WAY TO PREVENT THAT FROM OCCURRING.
[02:10:02]
WELL, I DON'T KNOW IF NO WAY, BUT ONE OF THE ADVANTAGES OF A CULVERT IS IT GIVES YOU AN AREA WHERE YOU CAN CLEAN OUT, BUT WHAT WE'VE FOUND FOUND IS THAT NOT ONLY DID THE CULVERT HAVE TO BE CLEANED OUT, BUT THE PIPE ALSO HAD TO BE CLEANED OUT.THAT WAS LEADING TO IT BECAUSE THERE WAS SO MUCH MM-HMM.
BUT IT LOOKS TO ME, BASED ON YOUR DRAWINGS, WHERE YOU HAVE TWIN CULVERTS BEHIND THE BUILDINGS ON EAST DALE AVENUE, 2 48 INCH TWIN CULVERTS GOING INTO A 48 INCH PIPE, UM, AND OF COURSE YOU LABEL THAT LOW FLOW AS OPPOSED TO THE HIGH FLOW FOR THE TWO TWIN TWIN CULVERTS.
UH, ISN'T THAT SOMETHING WE WOULD HAVE TO ADDRESS, UH, IN ORDER TO GET SOME KIND OF A SATISFACTORY RESULT? SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE REFERRING TO THESE, UH, I, I, I AM NOT MEANT TO IMPLY THAT THESE TWIN CULVERTS WERE HIGH FLOW, UM, THERE BY NO MEANS, UM, LARGE ENOUGH TO KIND OF KEEP UP WITH THE AMOUNT OF, OF FLOW THEY'RE RECEIVING.
UM, AND AGAIN, THESE, THESE NUMBERS HERE ARE BASED ON CLEANED PIPES, RIGHT? THAT'S KIND OF OUR BASELINE, DESPITE THE FACT THAT WE ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THAT'S NOT WHERE WE ARE TODAY.
UM, WE ACKNOWLEDGE THAT IT'S A, YOU KNOW, RELATIVELY, UH, REASONABLE PLACE TO GET TO WITH SOME, UM, HARD WORK, QUITE FRANKLY TO CLEAN THESE PIPES OUT.
UM, BUT TO THAT POINT, THE, THE IMPLICATION WAS NOT MEANT TO BE THAT THOSE TWIN 40 EIGHTS ARE, UM, ARE HIGH FLOW.
UM, IT, IT WAS MORE JUST TO DISTINGUISH BETWEEN WHAT IS OPEN CHANNEL AND WHAT IS PIPED.
I DID SEE A LEGEND SOMEWHERE WHERE THE BLUE WAS LOW FLOW AND THE RED WAS HIGH FLOW ON ONE OF THE SLIDES.
BUT I, I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING NOW.
IT'S NOT ACTUALLY A PIPE, IT'S THE, IT'S THE OPEN CHANNEL.
UM, OKAY, I'M GONNA MOVE ON TO, UM, SO AGAIN, JUST TO PUT A BOW ON THE FIRST PROPOSAL AGAIN, UM, A, A, A SOLUTION THAT, UM, WOULD, WOULD, WOULD SEEK TO ALLEVIATE WHAT IS FAIRLY FREQUENT, UM, PONDING HERE, UM, ON CENTRAL AVENUE.
AND, YOU KNOW, AS INDICATED BY, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, THE PHOTOS THAT WE HAVE HERE, AND I THINK THE, UM, YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT MOST FOLKS HAVE EXPERIENCED HERE ON CENTRAL AVENUE DURING, UM, YOU KNOW, MODERATE, QUITE FRANKLY, RAINFALL EVENTS.
UM, SO AGAIN, THERE ARE TWO DISTINCT THAT HAVE ISSUES.
UM, ONE IS CENTRAL AVENUE AND THE OTHER IS EAST HARTSDALE.
UM, THEY'RE VERY MUCH CONNECTED, UM, BUT WE'VE KIND OF VIEWED THEM AS, AS, AS KIND OF SOLUTIONS TO PROVIDE RELIEF DURING THAT TWO YEAR STORM, UH, FOR EACH OF THOSE DIFFERENT CELLS THAT COULD QUITE FRANKLY BE ENACTED INDEPENDENT OF EACH OTHER, BUT COULD ALSO BE ENACTED TOGETHER TO PROVIDE KIND OF A GREATER COMPREHENSIVE RELIEF FOR THE TWO YEAR.
UM, SO AGAIN, UM, SO AGAIN, UM, ABOUT 500 ACRES DRAINS TO THIS LAKE HERE OR HARTSDALE LAKE.
IT'S REALLY A, JUST A KIND OF A POND, UM, HERE ON THE GOLF COURSE PROPERTY.
UM, IT'S GOT AN EXISTING OUTLET STRUCTURE HERE THAT KIND OF, UH, UM, METERS OR, OR CONTROLS THE AMOUNT OF FLOW THAT CAN LEAVE THE POND.
IT'S GOT A VALVE SO THAT IT CAN BE ADJUSTED.
AND WE UNDERSTAND THAT THE GOLF COURSE DOES TAKE PROACTIVE STEPS TO KIND OF DRAIN THE POND DOWN IN ADVANCE OF STORM EVENTS TO PROVIDE SOME STORAGE.
UM, AGAIN, ALL OF THAT FLOW CONVERGES HERE, UM, AT THESE TWIN 48 INCH CULVERTS AND LOW FLOW CHANNELS THAT ARE, THAT RUN BEHIND AND UNDER THESE HARTSDALE BUILDINGS.
UM, SO THE PROPOSAL HERE WOULD BE TO USE THAT POND FOR SOME AMOUNT OF FLOOD STORAGE.
UM, THE POND, QUITE FRANKLY, FROM, FOR, FOR LIKE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM JUST DOES NOT HAVE THE SQUARE FOOTAGE OR VOLUME, UM, TO PROVIDE REAL APPRECIABLE BENEFITS IN THESE LARGE STORM EVENTS.
UM, LIKE THE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM, UM, IT'S JUST, IT'S JUST THE, THE, IT'S ABOUT FIVE ACRES COMPARED TO THE 500 ACRES.
UM, THAT KIND OF RATIO IS JUST NOT, NOT THERE TO, UM, PROVIDE MEANINGFUL DETENTION OR RETENTION
[02:15:01]
FOR THE A HUNDRED YEAR EVENT.UM, WITH THAT SAID, THERE ARE, ARE, UH, MECHANISMS THAT CAN BE, OR, OR PROCESSES OR IMPROVEMENTS THAT CAN BE PUT IN PLACE THAT CAN HELP PROVIDE RELIEF AGAIN FOR THAT TWO YEAR EVENT THAT, THAT IS, THAT MORE FREQUENT STORM THAT DOES PROVIDE, UH, IMPACT AND, AND KIND OF DAMAGE AND TO THE, UH, RESIDENCES ON EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE.
SO THAT WOULD INVOLVE, AND WHAT'S THE COST OF THAT? THIS, UH, THAT'S GONNA BE HAR HIGHLY VARIABLE.
YOU KNOW, IT COULD BE AS LITTLE AS LOW AS A FEW MILLION, AND IT COULD BE, AS, YOU KNOW, NORTH OF 10 MILLION.
THAT WILL REALLY DEPEND ON WHAT THE DISPOSAL COST AND THE DISPOSAL APPROACH IS FOR MATERIAL, UH, DREDGED FROM THE LAKE.
UM, THAT, THAT IS THE, THE, THE NUMBER ONE DRIVER IN THIS, UH, APPROACH.
SO THE APPROACH WOULD BE REMOVE ABOUT FOUR FEET OF MATERIAL FROM THAT LAKE, UH, TO, UM, PROVIDE ADDITIONAL FLOOD STORAGE.
UM, AGAIN, IF, IF THE MATERIAL IS, YOU KNOW, GOT CONTAMINATION OR, OR WHAT HAVE YOU, UM, THAT THOSE DISPOSAL COSTS KIND OF SKYROCKET, QUITE FRANKLY.
WHEREAS IF IT'S FAIRLY BENIGN, UM, IT CAN BE DONE, UM, FOR MUCH LOWER COST.
SO, SO THAT'S SOMETHING THAT AS WE REFINE THIS DESIGN, WE'RE GONNA NEED TO, TO DO SOME REAL FIELD INVESTIGATIONS TO, UM, SANITY CHECK.
UM, BUT RIGHT NOW WE'VE GOT A FAIRLY LARGE RANGE, UM, JUST ABSENT ANY OF THAT, THAT KIND OF KEY DRIVER.
UM, SO THIS APPROACH THAT WOULD PROVIDE ABOUT FOUR FOOT OF FLOOD STORAGE, UM, WOULD REDUCE THE PEAK FLOW AT THAT EAST HARTSDALE PINCH POINT SYSTEM BY OVER HALF, PROVIDE OVER A 50% REDUCTION, UH, IN THE PEAK FLOW.
AGAIN, THAT STILL PUTS US IN A POSITION WHERE THE FLOW TO THAT SYSTEM EXCEEDS THE CAPACITY OF THAT PINCH POINT.
UM, YOU KNOW, THAT PINCH POINT'S CAPACITY IS ONLY ABOUT ONE 30, WHEREAS EVEN WITH THIS, UM, RELIEF MEASURE, UM, WE'RE STILL EXCEEDING THAT QUITE A BIT.
BUT, UM, IT WILL, AND IF I, I BROUGHT THIS SLIDE BACK UP JUST TO KINDA SHOW, UH, IT, WE, WHAT WE ARE SEEING IN THE MODEL IS, YOU KNOW, CLOSE TO 18 INCH TO TWO FOOT REDUCTIONS IN INUNDATIONS HERE.
SO WHILE THESE PIPES UNDER EXISTING CONDITIONS COULD REMAIN SURCHARGED, UM, THE EXTENT TO WHICH THEY, UM, YOU KNOW, CAUSE FLOODING AND INUNDATION IN THAT TWO YEAR EVENT, IN, IN SPECIFICALLY KIND OF THIS AREA OF EAST HARTSDALE, UM, RESIDENCES, YOU KNOW, IS, IS APPRECIABLE.
UM, SO LIKE, UH, IF WE DID SAY THIS OPTION, UH, DURING THE HURRICANE, I GUESS IRIS, UM, UH, THERE WERE A LOT OF APARTMENTS THAT, UM, UH, THAT A LOT OF CARS WERE LOST AND, UH, SOME RESTAURANTS WENT OUT.
WOULD, WOULD THIS, UH, EFFORT HAVE, UH, SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCED THAT FROM HAPPENING WITH, WITH THE STORM THAT WE JUST HAD, YOU KNOW, LAST YEAR? PROBABLY NOT QUITE FRANKLY.
UM, JUST TO BE FRANK WITH YOU, PROBABLY NOT.
AND THAT'S, THAT'S PART OF THE, IN INCRE IDA IS A, UM, IS A HUNDRED YEAR STORM, RIGHT? I, I, I THINK, UH, I KNOW THE TERM THAT I, I'VE HEARD IT SAID QUITE A BIT THAT, YOU KNOW, WE GET A HUNDRED YEAR STORM EVERY YEAR NOW.
AND, AND THAT'S A LITTLE BIT OF HYPERBOLE FROM, FROM A STORMWATER STANDPOINT.
UM, IDA WAS THE REAL DEAL, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD.
IT WAS, YOU KNOW, EIGHT TO NINE INCHES OF RAINFALL.
UM, BEYOND THAT IT WAS, UM, W WE, FROM A STORMWATER STANDPOINT, UM, LOOK AT AMOUNT OF RAINFALL IN A 24 HOUR PERIOD, IDA WAS, UH, AN ANOMALY IN THAT IT DROPPED, UM, IN AN EXTREME AMOUNT OF RAINFALL IN A VERY SHORT PERIOD OF TIME.
UM, SO I BELIEVE WE, I BELIEVE WE GOT THREE INCHES IN AN HOUR, RIGHT? YES.
AND I, I KNOW THAT GARRETT HAD BEEN ONE POINT.
I THINK WE HAVE TO BE, I THINK WE HAVE TO BE HONEST WITH THE PUBLIC, THERE'S NO, YES, THERE'S NO STORM SYSTEM THAT CAN HANDLE THAT KIND OF A, UH, DELUGE OF WATER IN SUCH A SHORT PERIOD OF TIME.
STRETCH THAT OUT OVER 24 HOURS, WHICH WE DIDN'T HAVE THE LUXURY OF HAVING, 'CAUSE IT ALL CAME IN THE PEAK WAS THREE INCHES.
IT WAS MORE BEFORE AND AFTER IT.
BUT, UH, ACCORDING TO THE DATA THAT WE'VE SEEN, IT WAS THREE INCHES IN ONE HOUR.
AND NOTHING THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE, EVEN FOR THE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM, 'CAUSE I BELIEVE THAT RAN
[02:20:01]
TO A CATEGORY OF 700 YEAR STORM.MATTER OF FACT, THERE WASN'T EVEN A CHART THAT COULD HANDLE THAT NUMBER FROM WHAT I'VE SEEN.
UH, YES, BUT IT'S PREDICTED TO BE ABOUT A 700 YEAR STORM, EVEN THOUGH YOU HAD TO EXTRAPOLATE BECAUSE THEY NEVER ANTICIPATED HAVING THREE INCHES IN AN HOUR.
UM, AND, AND, AND YES, I I, I KNOW THAT THE TOWN HAD PROCURED SOME, SOME DATA, UM, FROM A, A THIRD PARTY VENDOR, UM, YOU KNOW, WHO, WHO HAD, WHO HAD, UM, HAD SAID THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT THAT, UM, THAT RAINFALL, UM, THAT BOARD MEMBER SHEHAN JUST, JUST REF, UM, JUST REFERENCED, YOU KNOW, COULD BE ON THE ONE IN A THOUSAND EVENT, RIGHT? I MEAN, I DON'T THINK THEY, TO, TO YOUR POINT, THEY DON'T HAVE THE, THEY DON'T EVEN HAVE IT'S OFF, IT'S SO OFF THE CHARTS THAT IT, YOU KNOW, DOESN'T EVEN HAVE A CLASSIFICATION.
UM, I, I AGREE WITH, WITH THE BOARD THAT, THAT A, A, A REALISTIC UNDERSTANDING OF, OF HOW THESE, UM, MEASURES CAN PROVIDE RELIEF IS, UM, IS, IS PRUDENT.
YOU KNOW, THESE FIRST TWO WE'VE WALKED THROUGH ARE, ARE TO RELIEVE, UM, KIND OF THAT ANNUAL OR MAYBE EVERY COUPLE OF YEARS, PONDING AND, AND INUNDATION THAT HAPPENS IN THESE AREAS OF, UM, BOTH FOUR CORNERS AND THE EAST DALE SYSTEM.
UM, AT, AT THAT POINT, EVEN WITH THESE ENACTED, UM, STORMS LIKE IDA, WHICH ARE THOSE, UM, I DON'T WANT TO GO AS FAR TO SAY ONCE IN A LIFETIME EVENTS, 'CAUSE THAT'S, THAT'S NOT THE CASE.
BUT THOSE STORMS LIKE IDA, UM, REQUIRE A MUCH MORE ROBUST, UM, A MUCH MORE ROBUST SOLUTION, WHICH, WHICH WE'LL GET INTO.
I JUST HAVE ONE OTHER QUESTION ABOUT, YOU KNOW, THE, THE EAST HARSDALE AVENUE, YOU KNOW, OPTION FOR THE TWO YEAR, YOU KNOW, STORM THAT YOU'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT, AND YOU KNOW, THE $10 MILLION, SAY IT'S A $10 MILLION FIX RIGHT NOW, UM, FOR THOSE TYPE OF STORMS. DO SOME OF THE BUSINESSES TEMPORARILY GO OUTTA BUSINESS BECAUSE OF THE FLOODING OR, YOU KNOW, ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT SIGN, YOU KNOW, SIGNIFICANT DAMAGE THAT HAS CAUSED, UM, CLOSURES OF BUSINESS AND PROPERTY DAMAGES, LOSS OF CARS, ET CETERA? I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING WE STILL NEED TO CALIBRATE A LITTLE BIT BETTER.
UM, QUITE FRANKLY, I KNOW THAT WE DO HAVE INSTANCES OF BACKUP AND, UM, UM, YOU KNOW, KIND OF, UM, UH, IMPACTS TO THE FLOODING OF THAT AREA.
THE EXTENT TO WHICH THOSE IMPACTS DRIVE PROPERTY DAMAGE IS SOMETHING THAT WE'RE, UM, IN THE PROCESS OF WORKING THROUGH.
I KNOW GARRETT IS, IS DILIGENT AT KIND OF, UH, COLLECTING CERTAIN, UM, RECEIPTS.
RECEIPTS IS A BROAD TERM, BUT, BUT KIND OF DATA AND THE HISTORICAL INFORMATION REGARDING, UM, WHAT EVENTS DROVE CERTAIN DAMAGES.
UM, BECAUSE AS WE GEAR UP TO SEEK GRANT FUNDING FOR THESE, UH, IMPROVEMENTS, UM, THAT IS A KEY DRIVER.
UM, BASICALLY, UM, THE GRANTS, UM, COMMITTEES, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD, WILL, UH, COMPARE THE COST OF DAMAGES TO THE COST OF IMPROVEMENTS.
AND IF THEY'RE AT THAT RIGHT RATIO, UM, DETERMINE THAT THAT GRANT MONEY IS APPROPRIATE.
UM, SO WE'VE BEEN WORKING AND WE'LL CONTINUE TO WORK TO REFINE THE ESTIMATES ASSOCIATED WITH, UM, WITH THE IMPROVEMENTS.
UM, THERE'S AN EFFORT ONGOING NOW TO KIND OF, UM, INVENTORY THE DAMAGE ASSOCIATED WITH DIFFERENT EVENTS, UM, AND, AND KIND OF QUANTIFY, UH, YOU KNOW, X DOLLARS PER X INCHES OF RAINFALL, Y DOLLARS PER Y INCHES OF RAINFALL.
SO, SO, UM, IN PROCESS ON THIS PARTICULAR SLIDE I HAD MENTIONED, WHY ISN'T THERE A 25 YEAR, UM, SCENARIO, UH, NOT, NOT TONIGHT, BUT IN PRIOR DISCUSSIONS SURE.
BECAUSE MOST MUNICIPALITIES HAVE BEEN BUILDING THEIR STORM ORDER SYSTEMS TO A 25 YEAR STORM.
AND I JUST, I JUST WANTED TO LET THE PUBLIC KNOW THE REASON WHY YOU DIDN'T DO A 25 YEAR STUDY IS THAT THAT INCREMENT DOESN'T REALLY GET YOU ANYTHING MORE.
YOU EITHER DO 10 OR YOU DO FIVE, UH, 50.
UH, THE 25, UH, DOES NOT REALLY ADDRESS MUCH, MUCH, MUCH MORE.
IS THAT, IS THAT STILL YEAH, THAT, THAT IS A FAIR STATEMENT.
[02:25:01]
ADDRESS A 10 OR A 25 YEAR STORM, UM, AND, AND, AND FOR MUNICIPALITY, AND MUNICIPALITY WILL VARY BY WHICH OF THOSE EVENTS, UM, UH, INFRASTRUCTURE CONVEYANCE SYSTEMS ARE DESIGNED TO, THE STATE RECOMMENDS 10, UM, SEVERAL MUNICIPALITIES WILL GO ONE STEP BEYOND AND, AND, AND BUMP IT UP TO THE 25.UM, BUT, BUT YOU'RE, YOU'RE EXACTLY RIGHT.
UM, AS WE'LL WALK INTO WHAT THE A HUNDRED YEAR SOLUTION LOOKS LIKE.
AND I'LL, AND I'LL ALSO, UM, AT THE END, UH, FLASH UP A COUPLE OF ALTERNATIVES THAT WERE KIND OF LEFT ON THE CUTTING ROOM FLOOR, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD.
UM, YOU'LL NOTICE THAT, UM, THE UNDERTAKING TO FIX THAT A HUNDRED YEAR STORM, UM, IT, IT, IT, OR THE, LET ME SAY, I SAID ANOTHER WAY.
THE UNDERTAKING TO FIX A 10 OR 25 YEAR STORM EVENT PUTS YOU IN THE, YOU MIGHT AS WELL FIX THE A HUNDRED YEAR EVENT RANGE IN, IN OUR OPINION.
UM, SO WITH THAT, UM, JUST TO PUT A BOW ON THE, THE, THE TWO YEAR POND DREDGING, UM, SOLUTION, AGAIN, THE, THE, THE CONS VERY MUCH SIMILAR TO CENTRAL AVENUE, UH, QUICK IMPLEMENTATION AND REAL RESULTS SOON, UM, THAT DON'T RELY ON EXTENSIVE DOWNSTREAM IMPROVEMENTS.
UM, THIS IS A REGULATED WATERCOURSE, SO THERE WILL BE A PERMITTING HURDLE TO KIND OF CROSS IN THAT.
UM, AND, AND LIKE I SAID BEFORE, IT DOESN'T FIX THE PROBLEM IN EAST HARTSDALE.
IT JUST LESSENS THE LOAD ON IT.
UM, SO THE A HUNDRED YEAR, WE DON'T HAVE, WE REALLY HAVE TO FIND OUT WHEN YOU SAY LESSEN, YOU KNOW, THE, YOU KNOW, I'D LIKE TO REALLY SEE THE EXTENT OF THE PROPERTY DAMAGE FROM YOUR TWO YEAR STORM.
BECAUSE IF THERE'S NOT, IF IT'S REALLY ADDRESSING SOME PUDDLES, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING THAT'S NOT YEP.
THAT SIGNIFICANT IS NOT WORTH SPENDING $10 MILLION ON IT.
AND, AND AGAIN, AND, AND REFINING WHAT THAT NUMBER IS, RIGHT? IS THAT NUMBER 10 OR IS IT TWO OR THREE? RIGHT.
IT'S, AGAIN, IT'S JUST GONNA BE SO DRIVEN BY, UM, WHAT IT TAKES TO ADD MORE STORAGE TO THIS POND, WHICH IS, WHICH IS AGAIN, DRIVEN BY SOME FIELD DATA THAT STILL JUST NEEDS TO BE COLLECTED.
UM, SO, UH, THE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM, AGAIN, IT'S, IT'S, UM, IT INVOLVES A SIMILAR APPROACH TO INSTALLING BOX CULVERTS HERE ON CENTRAL AVENUE, JUST BIGGER, UM, AND A LITTLE DEEPER, UM, THAT ELEVATION CONSTRAINT THAT EXISTS UNDER EXISTING CONDITIONS CAN BE, UM, KIND OF FINESSED ONCE YOU DO A MORE COMPREHENSIVE SOLUTION.
SO WHERE I WAS SAYING, YOU, YOU GO VERY WIDE AND SHALLOW, IF, IF YOU ARE COMBINING CENTRAL LAB IMPROVEMENTS WITH DOWNSTREAM IMPROVEMENTS, THERE ARE OPPORTUNITIES TO GO MUCH DEEPER AND GET MUCH MORE CAPACITY.
UM, SO IT'S A SIMILAR SOLUTION TO THAT TWO YEAR SOLUTION.
IT'S JUST ABOUT TWICE AS TALL AND TWICE AS WIDE.
UM, A SERIES OF CHANNELS THAT WOULD WORK THROUGH THE GOLF COURSE PROPERTY, UM, HERE ALONGSIDE THE, UM, BETWEEN THE GOLF COURSE AND THE BUILDINGS.
UM, AND I'LL, AND I'LL WALK THROUGH EACH ONE OF THESE LEGS IN A SECOND.
UM, AND THEN, UH, CULVERTS AGAIN THROUGH EAST HARTSDALE.
UM, THE PRICE TAG IN THIS, 'CAUSE I KNOW THE QUESTION'S COMING IS, IS HIGH, RIGHT? IT'S, IT'S IN THE 40 TO $50 MILLION RANGE.
UM, IT, IT IS QUITE AN UNDERTAKING, UM, FROM AN INFRASTRUCTURE STANDPOINT, UM, THAT IS JUST QUITE FRANKLY, COMMENSURATE WITH THE, WITH THE, THE PROBLEM THAT, THAT PERSISTS DURING THOSE A HUNDRED YEAR STORMS. UM, AND I GUESS WHEN PEOPLE, EARLY WHEN WE WERE TALKING ABOUT POSSIBLY, UH, 450 UNITS OF HOUSING, AND I WAS SORT OF A LITTLE, UM, YOU KNOW, I THOUGHT IT'S, IT WAS TOO MUCH.
PERHAPS THE ONLY WAY WE COULD REALLY GET TO THIS A HUNDRED YEAR STORM MITIGATION, IF IT'S A PARTNERSHIP WITH THE DEVELOPERS, UM, THE FEDERAL AND STATE GOVERNMENT.
SO IF WE REALLY WANNA SOLVE THE PROBLEM, WE PROBABLY HAVE TO GO WITH A HUNDRED YEAR STORM, YOU KNOW, MITIGATION, AND WE HAVE TO GET DEVELOPERS TO, UM, HELP, YOU KNOW, FOOT THE, THE COSTS OF, UH, OF THE MITIGATION.
I WOULD THINK, YEAH, IT'S, IT WILL DEFINITELY NEED TO BE A, A KIND OF A SHARED POOL OF FUNDING.
UM, YOU KNOW, IT'S INTERESTING AFTER, UH, THE STORM, NOT THIS STORM, THE LAST STORM, ONE OF THE, UH, LANDLORDS, UH, ON EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE WANTED, UH, TO BUILD UP AND, YOU KNOW, SAID THAT HE WANTED TO HAVE MORE AIR RIGHTS AND TEAR DOWN SOME OF THE, UH, BUILDINGS, UM, YOU KNOW, ON EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE, UM, AND, YOU KNOW, HAVE SOME EXCUSE, AND MAYBE THAT'S A CONCEPT THAT HAS TO BE ALSO, UH, YOU KNOW, DISCUSSED.
[02:30:01]
AGAIN, YOU KNOW, I, I JUST SORT OF FEEL THAT THE COST IS SO MUCH THAT WE JUST NEED PRIVATE INVESTMENT.I, I I, I DON'T SEE THIS HAPPENING AT ALL WITHOUT SIGNIFICANT FEDERAL MONEY.
THIS IS SO MASSIVE, UH, TO ASK A DEVELOPER TO NOT ONLY DO THE TRAFFIC IMPROVEMENTS WE WERE TALKING ABOUT SAYING THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY WOULD HAVE TO PICK UP PUTTING A, A POCKET LANE.
UH, THIS IS JUST SO MASSIVE, BUT THIS, THE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM IS WHAT WE ACTUALLY NEED TO BE ABLE TO DO, RIGHT? UH, BECAUSE EVERYTHING ELSE IS NOT GOING TO SOLVE THE WHAT HAS BECOME THE ROUTINE FLOODING, RIGHT? NO ONE'S EVER GOING TO BE ABLE TO, UM, BUILD FOR, UH, THREE INCHES IN AN HOUR.
NO SYSTEM WILL EVER BE ABLE TO HANDLE THAT.
BUT THE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM, UH, PARTICULARLY FOR THIS AREA, UH, IS SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO FIND A WAY TO FIND THE MONEY TO DO THIS.
UM, AND THEY MAY BE ABLE TO ADDRESS SOME OF THE ISSUES AT THE CORNERS.
UH, BUT WE ALSO, THE GOLF COURSE, YOU KNOW, THE GOLF COURSE HAS A, YOU KNOW, IT'S GONNA AFFECT THE GOLF COURSE, THERE'S NO DOUBT, EVEN THOUGH THEY DREW THE DREDGING.
SO IT DIDN'T SEEM LIKE IT, IT EFFECTED ANY OF THE TEES.
UH, BUT THERE WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO BE A PARTNERSHIP WITH THE GOLF COURSE AS WELL, AND AS, AS WELL AS THE, UH, THE OWNERS OF THE PROPERTIES ON EAST DALE AVENUE BECAUSE THE, THE, THE PIPE IS ON THEIR PROPERTY AND SOME CASES THE PIPE IS UNDERNEATH THEIR BUILDINGS.
IT'S NOT THEIR FAULT SOMEBODY BUILT THE BUILDING OVER THE PIPE.
UH, BUT IT'S, IT'S THE REALITY AND WE HAVE TO ADDRESS IT.
I'M SORRY, WHAT WAS THAT? I SAID VERY WELL SAID.
UM, UH, I KNOW I WAS, UH, OVER RUNNING LONG, SO I WILL, UH, I WILL KIND OF GET THROUGH THIS, BUT, UM, AGAIN, SIMILAR PROPOSAL, UH, LARGE BOX CULVERTS IN CENTRAL AVENUE, UH, FOLLOWED BY AN OPEN CHANNEL KIND OF, WE'RE MODELING THIS VERY MUCH AS LIKE KIND A TRAPEZOIDAL SYSTEM.
I THINK THERE ARE, THROUGH A REFINED DESIGN APPROACH ARE WAYS TO KIND OF DRESS THIS UP, MAKE IT, YOU KNOW, POTENTIALLY A LITTLE BIT MORE ECOLOGICALLY FRIENDLY AND, UM, MAYBE A BIT MORE OF A, A, YOU KNOW, THE EXTENT IT CAN BE AN AMENITY AND AMENITY.
BUT, UM, AGAIN, JUST FROM A STRICTLY HYDRAULIC STANDPOINT, WE'RE LOOKING AT CHANNELS ON THE MORE ORDER OF, YOU KNOW, 40 TO 80 FEET WIDE AT ITS TOP.
UM, AGAIN, RUNNING ALONGSIDE THIS WESTERN EDGE OF, OR THE, YES, SORRY, THE EASTERN EDGE OF THE GOLF COURSE, EXCUSE ME.
UM, AND THEN SIMILARLY, UM, A A SERIES OF VERY LARGE BOX CULVERTS THAT WOULD RUN, UH, IN THIS SECTION OF EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE.
UH, THE BIGGEST CHALLENGE THERE IS JUST GONNA BE ALL OF THE EXISTING UTILITIES THAT ARE IN THE STREET.
UM, YOU KNOW, THAT WOULD HAVE TO GET, UM, ACCOMMODATED AROUND THIS.
UM, AGAIN, NOT A SMALL UNDERTAKING, BUT, BUT, UM, TO BOARD MEMBER SHARON'S POINT, UM, YOU KNOW, NOT A SMALL PROBLEM TO ADDRESS EITHER.
UM, I'D MENTIONED A COUPLE OF ALTERNATIVES THAT WERE KIND OF LEFT ON THE CUTTING ROOM FLOOR.
UM, WE HAD LOOKED AT ANOTHER ALTERNATE THAT WOULD'VE KIND OF, UM, REROUTED THAT WATERCOURSE THROUGH WHAT IS NOW THE GOLF COURSE POND, UM, TO ANOTHER SET OF CULVERTS IN A VERY SIMILAR SCENARIO.
UM, YOU KNOW, FROM JUST A PRACTICALITY STANDPOINT, THIS WOULD KIND OF BLOW UP THE CENTRAL FEATURE OF THAT GOLF COURSE.
AND IT'S, IT'S PROBABLY NOT, UM, YOU KNOW, ALL THAT FEASIBLE JUST FROM A, YOU KNOW, A, A PRACTICAL PARTNERSHIP STANDPOINT.
BUT, BUT WE DID LOOK AT OTHER WAYS TO KIND OF, UM, GET THAT WATER FROM POINT A TO POINT B, UM, AND THEN WE LOOKED AT A 10 YEAR SOLUTION.
UM, AGAIN, UM, THIS IS A SCENARIO WHERE MAYBE THIS ISN'T AN OPEN CHANNEL, AND, AND YOU COULD POTENTIALLY, THE REAL BENEFIT OF THIS SOLUTION IS THAT YOU COULD POTENTIALLY AVOID SOME OF THAT EXTENSIVE UTILITY, UM, YOU KNOW, KIND OF DISRUPTION TO EAST HARTSDALE HERE.
UM, AND YOU COULD POTENTIALLY KIND OF SQUEEZE IT BACK HERE OR MAYBE, UM, YOU KNOW, IN, IN KIND OF, UH, UM, BUILT INTO THE KIND OF THE, THE PROGRAM OF A, UH, UH, UM, A MIXED USE OR, OR, OR REDEVELOPMENT OF THESE PARCELS HERE.
UM, BUT IN ANY CASE, THIS IS KIND OF WHERE A COUPLE OF SHOWS THAT THAT, THAT ONCE YOU START RIPPING INTO THIS SLOPE AND CUTTING THROUGH THE GOLF COURSE AND, AND, AND DOING CENTRAL AVE AND,
[02:35:01]
UM, ALL TO JUST STILL BE VULNERABLE TO A HUNDRED YEAR EVENT, UM, IS WHERE WE KIND OF LANDED ON, UM, THE TWO TO THE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM.WHILE A MAJOR GAP, UM, SOLVING ANYTHING BIGGER THAN THE TWO YEAR STORM, UM, IS, IT BECOMES SUCH AN EXPENSE THAT, UM, IT, IT, IT, IT REALLY BECOMES PRUDENT TO JUST KIND OF LOOK UP A LEVEL.
UM, AND THEN JUST AT A VERY HIGH LEVEL IN THE NEAR TERM, UM, WHAT WE DID, WHAT GARRETT AND I DID HEAR FROM SEVERAL PROPERTY OWNERS, UH, DURING IDA, UM, SO WE, WE, WE GOT SOME GOOD NEWS AND WE GOT SOME BAD NEWS.
ACTUALLY, THE GOOD NEWS WAS THE FOLKS THAT, UH, IMPLEMENTED FLOOD DOORS, AND I BELIEVE THEY'RE THE PROPERTY RIGHT HERE, GARRETT, IF I'M WRONG, BUT FOLKS THAT IMPLEMENTED FLOOD DOORS IN THE REAR OF THEIR PROPERTY SAW REAL SUCCESS FROM THOSE FLOOD DOORS, UH, IN KEEPING THAT WATER OUT FROM BREACHING, UM, THE, THE GROUND FLOOR.
UM, SO THAT'S AN EXAMPLE OF A STRATEGY THAT COULD BE IMPLEMENTED OR REPEATED ELSEWHERE FOR, FOR PROPERTY OWNERS THAT ARE EXPERIENCING, UH, SIMILAR ISSUES.
UM, THE OTHER THING WE HEARD WAS THAT, UM, SOME OF THE FLOODING, ESPECIALLY IN CELLAR SPACES DURING IDA, WAS ACTUALLY DRIVEN BY, UH, BACKUP, UH, WHETHER IT BE FROM KIND OF FLOOR DRAINS, OR I'M NOT SURE IF IT WAS FROM ALSO TOILETS, BUT AT VERY LEAST FLOOR DRAINS.
SO, UM, INSTALLING BACKFLOW, UH, VALVES ON THOSE DRAINS, THOSE CONNECTIONS TO THE STORM SEWERS OR, OR IF IT'S SANITARY, UM, ARE ANOTHER KIND OF LOW HANGING FRUIT, FOR LACK OF BETTER WORD, THAT, UH, COULD BE IMPLEMENTED TO KIND OF, TO KIND OF, UM, ADDRESS SOME OF THESE PROPERTY DAMAGE ISSUES THAT WE'RE SEEING NOW IN THE INTERIM OF, OF ONE OR ANY OF THESE KIND OF LARGER SCALE SOLUTIONS, UM, THAT ARE, ARE GONNA TAKE TIME FOR DESIGN AND FUNDING AND CONSTRUCTION, UH, TO, TO BE IMPLEMENTED.
UM, SO THAT'S THE CONCLUSION OF OUR PRESENTATION.
AGAIN, UH, THE BIG TAKEAWAY HERE IS, UM, THE, YOU KNOW, THE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM SOLUTION, UM, IS BY NO MEANS A SIMPLE FIX.
THERE ARE THINGS THAT CAN BE DONE IN THE NEAR TERM TO, TO PROVIDE RELIEF, UM, SUPERVISOR'S FINER POINT, UM, QUANTIFYING THAT DAMAGE ASSOCIATED WITH THE TWO YEAR EVENT WILL BE, UM, CRITICAL AT UNDERSTANDING THE REAL MERIT OF THOSE, UM, SOLUTIONS.
UM, BUT, BUT BOTH FROM AN EXISTING CONDITIONS INVENTORYING STANDPOINT AND, AND STARTING TO DEVISE, YOU KNOW, REAL SOLUTIONS TO MOVE FORWARD.
UM, I THINK WE'RE AT A GOOD POINT RIGHT NOW TO START PURSUING GRANTS IN TERMS OF, I'M NOT SURE IF THIS WOULD BE, UM, A QUESTION FOR YOU, BUT, UM, IF THERE'S UNDERGROUND WATER, UM, YOU KNOW, AND WE'RE LOOKING AT REDEVELOPING THE FOUR, YOU KNOW, THE FOUR CORNERS, UM MM-HMM.
AND I THINK REDEVELOPMENT ON ITSELF WILL, UH, AID IN THAT FACT, UM, NEWER DEVELOPMENTS AND, UM, MANY MUNICIPALITIES, UM, WHITE PLAINS, UH, WE REPRESENT PORTCHESTER S BEHALF OF PORTCHESTER, UH, REQUIRE THAT NEW DEVELOPMENTS DON'T DISCHARGE GROUNDWATER TO THE STORM SEWERS.
SO IF YOU DO HAVE A SUBSURFACE CELLAR OR A SUBSURFACE PARKING GARAGE, THAT THOSE, THOSE STRUCTURES ARE BUILT WATER TIGHT TO KIND OF RESIST ANY GROUNDWATER AND, UM, KEEP IT OUT AND KEEP IT AWAY FROM THE STORM SEWER.
UM, OLDER DEVELOPMENTS WILL OFTEN HAVE SOME PUMPS AND CONNECTIONS AND, AND THEN THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT, THAT WILL ACTUALLY ADD A LOAD TO THE, UM, TO THE, THE STORM SEWER IF GROUNDWATER IS BEING DISCHARGED THERE.
SO, UM, IT WILL HAVE TO DEFINITELY BE VETTED OUT DURING THE SITE DESIGN OF ANY DEVELOPMENT AT FOUR CORNERS.
BUT THE DEVELOPMENT ON ITSELF, UM, REGARDLESS, SHOULD PROVIDE SOME SORT OF, UH, HOPEFULLY AT LEAST A REDUCTION IN THE AMOUNT OF GROUNDWATER THAT MIGHT BE CONTRIBUTING TO THE, UM, AND, AND THE AIR.
THE AREA ALSO GETS, YOU KNOW, WE GET FLOODING ON THE BRONX RIVER AND YEP.
IF WE ADDRESS SOME, UH, YOU KNOW, FLOODING SAY ON EAST HARTSDALE AVENUE NEAR THE GOLF COURSE, WOULD THAT HAVE, WHILE WE'RE DOING THAT WORK, WILL THERE BE ANY IMPACTS TO THE BRONX RIVER? SO THE WAY, CAN WE BE CRE UH, MITIGATING, UM, YOU KNOW, FLOODING ON ONE AND CREATING A BIGGER PROBLEM ON THE BRONX RIVER? I'M JUST WONDERING.
SO NO, IT'S A, IT'S A REALLY GOOD POINT.
UM, IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE'VE LOOKED INTO AND, AND, AND PREVIOUS ENGINEERS WHO HAVE LOOKED AT THIS ISSUE HAVE ALSO LOOKED INTO,
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UM, THE WAY IT, THE, THE SIMPLEST I CAN PUT IT IS, UM, BY THE TIME, IF, IF YOU, IF YOU THINK OF IT ALMOST LIKE AN AVALANCHE OR A TIDAL WAVE, UM, BY THE TIME THE WATER FROM FOUR CORNERS GETS TO BRONX RIVER, UM, IN ANY OF THESE SCENARIOS, IT'S WELL IN FRONT OF THAT KIND OF TIDAL WAVE OR THAT AVALANCHE OF WATER THAT'S COMING DOWN THE PEAKS BASICALLY, UH, HAPPEN AT, AT DIFFERENT PERIODS.SO THERE'S, UM, NOT AN EXPECTATION THAT ANY OF THESE A HUNDRED YEAR SOLUTIONS WOULD EXACERBATE, UH, FLOODING CONDITIONS IN THE BRONX RIVER.
THAT RIVER IS DEALING WITH A MUCH LARGER DRAINAGE AREA, UM, IF WE HAD LINED THE PEAK UP, WHEREAS, UM, WE'RE, UH, SENDING OUR WATER TO THE BRONX RIVER AS THE, THE HIGHEST OF HIGH FLOWS ARE FLOWING THROUGH THE BRONX RIVER.
AND, AND, AND TO THE, YOU KNOW, THREE INCHES OF RAINFALL IN AN HOUR, UH, SITUATION.
THERE MAY BE MERIT TO THAT, THAT QUESTION IN TERMS OF THAT SCENARIO.
BUT, BUT IN, IN THE STRICTLY THE KIND OF, UH, A HUNDRED YEAR STORM, ABOUT NINE INCHES AND 24 HOURS, THE WAY THE, THE PEAKS LINE UP, THE WAY THE PEAK DISCHARGES, THE TIMING LINES UP, UM, WE DON'T EXPECT TO EXACERBATE, UH, THAT A HUNDRED YEAR FLOOD PLAIN FOR THE BRONX RIVER RIVER.
YOU KNOW, ALSO HAS A GOLF COURSE, UH, YOU KNOW, BEEN, UH, YOU KNOW, CONTACTED RELATING TO LIKE, SAY DREDGING AND ARE, ARE THEY? YES.
THEY'VE BEEN, ARE THEY RECEPTIVE? YES, I, I CAN SPEAK TO THAT SUPERVISOR.
UM, I WILL SAY THE, THE GOLF COURSE HAS BEEN, UH, EXTREMELY COOPERATIVE GIVEN THIS A LOT OF HISTORICAL INFORMATION AND, UH, FOR, REGARDING THE DREDGING, IN FACT, THEY'VE, UM, INDICATED THAT THEY WOULD, UH, WELCOME A PARTNERSHIP WITH THE TOWN WITH DESIGN AND, UH, CONSTRUCTION, UH, FUNDING GRANTS.
SO, UH, THE GOLF COURSE HAS, HAS BEEN, UH, VERY RECEPTIVE.
UM, WE, YOU KNOW, WE DID PRESENT SOME OF THE ALTERNATE OPTIONS FOR THE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM, AND, UM, AS YOU WOULD EXPECT, AND I THINK AS JUSTIN ALLUDED TO, UM, THE GOLF COURSE HAD MAJOR CONCERNS WITH, UM, A SIGNIFICANT CHANNEL THAT WOULD CUT THROUGH THE CENTER OF ITS COURSE AND, AND MAJORLY IMPACT, UH, GOLF, GOLF HOLES AND GOLF, UM, DIFFERENT AREAS OF THE GOLF COURSE.
BUT, UM, THEY, THEY, THEY WERE EVEN RECEPTIVE TOWARDS, UH, A HUNDRED YEAR OPTION THAT STAYED ON THE PERIPHERY.
NOW, YOU KNOW, WHICH, WHICH, YOU KNOW, IS DIFFICULT.
'CAUSE I HAVE, I HAVE GOTTEN A FEW EMAILS HERE, AND YES, INDEED WHEN JUSTIN HAD THAT AERIAL, UM, FOR THE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM OPTION, WHAT YOU SEE IS, YOU KNOW, ROSE OF, OF, OF STANDS OF TREES AND, UM, YOU KNOW, THAT WOULD HAVE TO BE SIGNIFICANTLY INTERRUPTED.
SO, UM, YOU KNOW, THAT, THAT IS CERTAINLY, YOU KNOW, NOT A BENEFIT OF, OF, OF HUGGING THE NORTH SIDE OF THE GOLF COURSE, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE TO BE RESPECTFUL OF, YOU KNOW, THEIR OPERATION.
SO, UM, I THINK WHEN JUSTIN INDICATED WORKING IN THE ECOLOGICAL PERSPECTIVE, YOU KNOW, MASSIVE REPLANTING, UM, WOULD BE A PART OF, OF, UH, ANY TYPE OF, OF A HUNDRED YEAR SOLUTION THAT REALLY HUGS THE NORTH PART OF THE GOLF COURSE.
BUT JUST TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, UM, THE GOLF COURSE HAS BEEN, UH, EXTREMELY HELPFUL AND, UH, ACCOMMODATING TO, YOU KNOW, ALL OF THIS PLANNING.
AND, UM, THERE CERTAINLY, YOU KNOW, HAVE TO BE A PARTNER AND, UH, I'M, I'M GLAD THAT THEY'RE A PARTNER SO FAR.
WE HAVE TWO OTHER AGENDA ITEMS, YOU KNOW, I THINK, SO WE DON'T HAVE TO MAKE A DECISION TODAY.
WE COULD DO IT EVEN NEXT WEEK.
BUT WE DID SAY THAT IF SOMEBODY SENT IN THEIR COMMENTS, I KNOW THE SUPERVISOR WAS READING SOME OF THEM, BUT GARRETT, ARE THERE ANY MAJOR COMMENTS THAT YOU SEE? I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF GOOD COMMENTS.
SOME HAVE BEEN ANSWERED, UM, AS THE PRESENTATION UNFOLDED, BUT WHAT I'D LIKE TO DO IS, UM, I THINK COLLECT THEM AND, UM, WE CAN PROVIDE RESPONSES.
I'LL MAKE SURE THAT, UH, WE WRITE BACK TO EVERY INDIVIDUAL THAT SENT IN A, A QUESTION AND, UM, WE'LL, WE'LL PROVIDE THEM WITH A RESPONSE.
THIS WAS REALLY VERY, VERY, UH, INFORMATIVE AND, YOU KNOW, VERY INTERESTING.
WE HAVE, WE MOVED FOR EXECUTIVE SESSION SECOND.
YOU GOTTA SAY WHY, UH, FOR THE PURPOSES OF DISCUSSING, UM, A LAND USE, WOULD IT BE YEAH, THAT SOME STUFF NICELY.
NEGOTIATION OF A CONTRACT, RIGHT? THERE'S ALSO A NEGOTIATION OF A CONTRACT AND SOME PERSONNEL ISSUES INVOLVING INDIVIDUAL PEOPLE.
SO, SO I'M CLEAR THAT I RENEW MY.