* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. THANK [00:00:01] YOU. [ TOWN OF GREENBURGH ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS AGENDA THURSDAY, July 16, 2026 – 7:00 P.M. ] THIS IS THE ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS. WE ARE GOING TO HAVE A ROLL CALL. WE'RE GONNA BEGIN OUR ROLL CALL. MADAM CHAIR E BUNTING SMITH YES, IS PRESENT. CHRISTINE NEFF IS ABSENT. LOUIS CRITCHLOW IS ABSENT. DIANE BERLEY HERE IS PRESENT. WILLIAM BLAND IS ABSENT. SHAUNA DICKINSON. PRESENT IS PRESENT. PETER BLAIR HERE IS PRESENT. HOWARD JACOBOWITZS, PETER IS PRESENT. AND THAT CONCLUDES OUR ROLL CALL. MADAM CHAIR, YOU NOTE, YOU NOTE FROM THE CALLING OF THE ROLE TONIGHT THAT THERE IS A PERMANENT MEMBER OF THE BOARD THAT IS ABSENT. AND IN LIGHT OF THAT VACANCY, WE WILL DESIGNATE HOWARD JACOB, JACOB ON AN ALTERNATE MEMBER TO VOTE ON ANY MANNER THAT REQUIRES A VOTE AT TONIGHT'S MEETING. THE MEETING OF THE ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS FOR THE TOWN OF GREENBURG WILL COME TO ORDER. WE HAVE FOUR CASES SCHEDULED FOR TONIGHT'S MEETING. HOWEVER, 25 36, WHICH IS ONE HARDLEY LAWRENCE HARDLEY, LLC, IS AWAITING SECRET FROM DETERMINATION BY THE TOWN BOARD. AND THE OTHER CASE THAT WOULD NOT BE SCHEDULED TONIGHT IS CASE 26 12, WHICH IS STEVE, CAN YOU PRONOUNCE THAT? IT'S ICK. 19 PLEASANT LANE IS ADJOURNED AS OF RIGHT BY THE APPLICANT TO AUGUST 20. SO LOOKING FORWARD, THE ZONING BOARD WILL HAVE OUR NEXT REGULAR MEETING ON THURSDAY, AUGUST 20TH. PLEASE MARK YOUR CALENDAR ACCORDINGLY. WE MAY LIMIT TIME TO HEAR EACH CASE, WHICH I DON'T THINK WE WILL HAVE THAT PROBLEM TONIGHT. BUT IF WE CAN'T FI FINISH HEARING A CASE, IT WOULD BE ADJOURNED TO ANOTHER MEETING TO BE COMPLETED AT THAT TIME, AS IN THE PAST. IN ORDER TO SAVE TIME, WE WILL READ, WAIVE THE READING OF THE PROPERTY LOCATION AND THE RELIEF SOUGHT FOR EACH CASE. HOWEVER, THE REPORTER WILL INSERT THIS INFORMATION IN THE RECORD. THIS INFORMATION ALSO APPEARS IN THE AGENDA FOR TONIGHT'S MEETING. AFTER EACH PUBLIC HEARING OF TONIGHT'S CASES, THE BOARD WILL MEET TO DISCUSS THE CASE. EVERYONE IS WELCOME TO LISTEN TO OUR DELIBERATIONS, BUT THE PUBLIC IS NOT PERMITTED TO SPEAK OR PARTICIPATE AT THAT TIME. AFTER OUR DELIBERATIONS ON ALL THE CASES, WE WILL ANNOUNCE THE BOARD'S DECISION FOR THE FORMAL RECORD AND FOR IT TO BE BROADCAST TO THE COMMUNITY. IF YOU'RE GOING TO SPEAK TONIGHT, YOU MUST COME UP TO THE MICROPHONE. STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS OR YOUR PROFESSIONAL AFFILIATION. WE HAVE HEARD TESTIMONY ON I THINK BOTH OF THESE CASES AT A PRIOR MEETING, AND THAT PRIOR TESTIMONY IS ALSO IN THE RECORD AND SHOULD NOT BE REPEATED. SO THE FIRST CASE WE WILL HEAR TESTIMONY ON TONIGHT IS CASE 26 0 9. CARMEN JARAMA, 22 BEACH STREET. GOOD EVENING EVERYBODY. EMILIO ESCALADAS, ESCALADAS ASSOCIATES, ARCHITECTS AND ENGINEERS. MAD. I'M CHAIR LADY. I MUST SAY YOUR GREEN JACKET. IT'S OUTSTANDING. IT'S BEAUTIFUL. IT'S A NICE COLOR. I NEVER SEEN IT AND I HAVE TO SAY IT. THANK YOU WHEN YOU NEED IT, JUST CALL ME UP, . UM, WE'RE HERE BECAUSE I MISSED A MEETING LAST TIME. I WAS ACTUALLY I KNOW YOU DID. I MISSED YOU. I, I WAS DESPERATELY TRYING TO GET THROUGH MY COMPUTER AND I WAS YELLING AT THE COMPUTER, BUT, AND HER DAUGHTER WAS TRYING TO, I KIND OF COACHED HER TO SAY THE RIGHT THING AND I TOLD HER I'M GONNA BE JOINING, BUT SOMEHOW I COULDN'T. I DIDN'T HAVE THE RIGHT INVITE, WHATEVER. UM, I'M, I'M NOT OF THAT GENERATION, BUT I'M HERE TODAY. I MADE IT. I MADE IT, I MADE IT IN ONE PIECE. WHAT WE'RE HERE TO TRY TO RECTIFY IS FOR CAR CARMEN'S BACKYARD. WHEN SHE, I JUST FOUND OUT TONIGHT THAT WHEN SHE BOUGHT THE PROPERTY, THE WHOLE BACKYARD WAS TOTALLY DIFFERENT. UM, UH, IT HAD A GARAGE. IT HAD PAVEMENT. I MENTIONED THIS BECAUSE IS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT COVERAGE IMPERMEABLE PAVEMENT. SO YOUR DECISION REALLY WILL BE BASED ON WHETHER YOU CONSIDER IT APPRO APPROPRIATE TO LEAVE THE EXISTING CONDITIONS, WHICH I, UM, ARE, UH, THE MAXIMUM THAT WE ARE ALLOWED TO HAVE IN THAT ZONING IS 43.75. WHAT, UM, USED TO BE WAS 91.5. AND WHAT SHE NOW HAS REDUCED IT TO WITH THE CAVEATS THAT [00:05:01] WE, UH, ARE ASKING FOR, WHICH IS A SHED, BASICALLY IT BRINGS IT DOWN TO, UH, 71, 73 0.6. THE WAY I LOOK AT IT, WE ARE, WE'RE ACTUALLY BENEFITING THE EXISTING PREVIOUS CONDITION OF 91.5% OF COVERAGE. WE'RE BRINGING IT DOWN TO 73. HOWEVER, WE NEED YOUR BLESSING BECAUSE THE MAX IN THAT AREA IS A VERY TIGHT 43, WHICH IS JUST HALF OF THE PROPERTY. AND IF YOU THINK OF WHAT A 50 BY A HUNDRED LOT IS, AND WE COULD WALK ALMOST IN ANY PROPERTY THAT AS A 50 BY A HUNDRED SITUATION. AND YOU'LL FIND THAT BY THE TIME THE DRIVEWAY IS COUNTED, UM, AND BY THE TIME THE WALKWAYS TO THE HOUSE ARE COUNTED, BY THE TIME THE AREA OF THE, UH, FOOTPRINT OF THE HOUSE IS COUNTED, WE EASILY, WE EASILY CAN EX UH, UH, UH, UH, SO O OVER OVER BILLED BY FIF OVER 50%. SO ANYWAY, BUT THE, THE, UM, THE ORIGINAL CONDITIONS, UM, THAT, UM, THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT SAW AND ISSUED VIOLATIONS, I WANT YOU TO SEE THE PICTURE AND THE DRAWING ON SHEET TWO, WHICH IS THE KIND OF QUALITY AND TYPE OF, UH, LOVE THAT, UH, CARMEN HAS TOWARDS HER PROPERTY. YOU, THAT WAS THAT THOSE DRAWING? NO, THOSE PICTURES ARE THE REMOVAL OF THE EXISTING, UH, UH, DRAW. UH, WHAT YOU'LL, WHAT WHAT YOU'RE GONNA SEE IN THE SECOND PAGE. THAT'S WHAT WAS REMOVED. SO JUST TO PROVE TO EVERYBODY THAT EVERYTHING WAS REMOVED, THAT WAS ILLEGALLY BUILT. BUT IF YOU GO TO THE SECOND, THE NEXT PAGE, UH, NO, THAT'S THE SITE PLAN SHOWING WHERE THE HOUSE IS AND WHERE THE BACKYARD IS. BUT THERE'S ANOTHER PAGE. I'M, I'M, I'M SURE GO KEEP. NO, NO. OKAY. SO YOU DON'T HAVE THE ONE I HAVE HERE FOR SOME REASON. UM, NO, NO, NO. THAT'S CORRECT. I'M SORRY. UH, YOU WERE LOOKING AT THE RIGHT ONE. THAT, THAT'S RIGHT. SO GO BACK TO THAT, UH, WHERE IT SHOWED THE FINISHED PRODUCT. UM, THIS IS WHAT THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT SAW WHEN THEY WALKED, UH, TO THE BACK. UM, AND I CERTAINLY WOULD BE VERY PROUD TO HAVE A PARTY IN THAT BACKYARD. AND IT WAS DONE. SHE'S A, SHE'S A PROFESSIONAL, UH, UH, A CONTRACTOR. AND SHE, SHE LOOKED AT, UH, I'M SORRY I MADE YOU TURN IT AWAY, BUT, UM, I WANT YOU TO SEE THE QUALITY OF THE WORK. IT, IT WOULD BE THE NEXT PAGE. THE PHOTOS. THE PHOTO, YES. THAT ONE, WHEN YOU LOOK AT IT, YOU SEE EVERYBODY HAS A BACKYARD OR A FAMILY MEMBER THAT HAS DONE A BACKYARD. AND THAT WAS ACTUALLY DONE BEAUTIFULLY. UH, THE PROBLEM WAS THAT AS THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, UH, TOLD US THE VIOLATION IS THAT YOU HAVE TOO MUCH OF IT. UM, AND THE FIRST THING THAT WE WERE ASKED TO DO, OF COURSE, IS TO OBTAIN A DRAINAGE, UH, STORMWATER PERMIT FOR ALL THE OTHER SURFACES THAT WERE NOT PROPERLY DRAINED. WE DID THAT. AND, UH, AND THEN WE ARE PROPOSING TO DO WHAT WAS WHAT'S ON THE, ON THE SHEET, WHICH IS SIMPLY TO HAVE, UM, A, A, A SHED. AND THE REST OF THE PATIO WILL BE, UH, A GRASSED AREA. UM, AND THAT'S IT. UH, AND THAT EVEN AFTER WE DO ALL THAT, WE STILL HAVE, UM, A 70, AT 73.6%. BUT I, I PROPOSE TO YOU THAT THAT IS A VERY HUMBLE, UM, A MIX OF, OF COVERAGES BASED ON THE FACT THAT WHEN YOU START WITH A 50 BY A HUNDRED, YOU REALLY HAVE VERY, VERY LITTLE TO WORK WITH IN THE BACK. SO THE ESSENCE, WHAT YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER IN THE LESSON IS THAT CARBON COVERED THE ENTIRE BACKYARD BEAUTIFULLY. THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT CAME IN, SHE IMMEDIATELY REMOVED IT. I WOULD'VE SUGGESTED TO HER, I SAID, LET'S GO TO THE, LET'S GO TO THE BOARD AND LET'S TRY TO GET A VARIANCE FOR THIS CONDITION. AND SHE SAID, NO, IT'S, APPARENTLY, IT'S MORE THAN I SHOULD HAVE. SHE TOOK IT OUT. AND THEN ALL WE WE STAYED WITH WAS THE STORAGE SHED, WHICH SHE NEEDS FOR HER, FOR HER TOOLS AND STUFF. SO THAT'S, HERE'S WHERE WE ARE. THE, THE HOUSE IS IMPECCABLY DONE. SHE REDID IT TWO OR THREE YEARS AGO. UH, I WAS THE ARCHITECT. WE REDID AN OLDER HOUSE THAT WAS BASICALLY FALLING DOWN. SHE REDID IT BEAUTIFULLY. UM, UM, I'M VERY PROUD OF, OF, OF THE WORK THAT SHE DOES AS SHE, AS IS SHE. AND, UH, ACTUALLY, I WAS VERY SURPRISED THAT THE, THE NEIGHBORS CALLED BECAUSE I WOULD BE VERY HAPPY THAT A NEIGHBOR WOULD DO THAT TYPE OF IMPROVEMENT TO A HOUSE NEXT TO MINE. BUT THESE ARE THE WAY THAT THINGS ARE. AND, UM, I THINK, I THINK THE NEIGHBOR EVEN ASKED HER TO DO AN IMPROVEMENT ON HER HOUSE TO GET A PRICE. I THINK, I THINK THAT WAS VERY FUNNY WHEN I HEARD THAT. UM, BUT THAT'S IT. I I, I'M READY FOR ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU MIGHT HAVE HISTORICALLY. CARMEN IS HERE IF YOU WANT TO QUESTIONNAIRE AS TO WHAT SHE DID, WHY SHE DID IT, UH, AND SO ON. WELL, LOOKING AT WHAT, UH, IS ON THE AGENDA, IT SHOWS [00:10:01] THAT THERE'S A CREATION OF A STORAGE ROOM IN THE BASEMENT. AND IS THAT, THAT IS, I ASSUME, FOR S STORAGE, UH, AND THAT THE HOUSE ITSELF IS FAIRLY SIZABLE. YES. AND FOR THE NEW CONSTRUCTION. UM, I WAS WONDERING IS, IS IT THAT THE MATERIALS THAT SHE HAS, THAT SHE WANTS TO BE IN THE SHED OR THINGS THAT ARE, THAT WOULD BE OUTSIDE AS OPPOSED TO BRINGING IT INSIDE AND STORING IT OR NOT? I I ONLY HEARD HALF OF WHAT YOU WERE SAYING. YOU ARE, YOU'RE, YOU ARE SAYING, I MEAN, THE SHED THAT SHE, THAT SHE HAS IS 10, 10 FEET BY SIX 15 FEET, WHICH IS CONSIDERING THAT THE PROPERTY ITSELF IS SO SMALL. I WAS JUST WONDERING, WHAT IS IT THAT WHEN YOU SAY TOOLS, TOOLS DON'T TAKE UP THAT MUCH WORK? AND CONSIDERING THAT SHE DOESN'T HAVE THAT, THAT MUCH OF A, I MEAN, THE, THE PROPERTY TAKES UP MOST OF THE YARD. REALLY? YES, IT DOES. IT IS. IT'S WHY, THIS IS WHY SHE WANTED TO PAY, BECAUSE SHE HAS GRANDCHILDREN THAT COME AND PLAY AND, AND THEN THE DIRT AND THIS AND THAT. IT JUST, THAT'S TOO MUCH. LET ME, LET ME JUST DO, AND, AND IT MUST, IT'S INTERESTING 'CAUSE THAT THE WAY SHE HAD IT, ALL THE STORAGE THAT WAS PROVIDED BY THE GRAVEL UNDERNEATH, WE LOST, WE HAD A GOOD, A GOOD, NICE STORAGE AREA UNDERNEATH. BUT WE, WE HAVE ADDED ADDITIONAL IMPROVEMENTS FOR THAT. HOWEVER, THE, THE JOB WHEN I SAW IT IS, THAT'S TOO BAD THAT YOU TAKE IT, TAKE IT APART. 'CAUSE IT'S REALLY NICELY DONE. UH, BUT HERE WE ARE. SHE TOOK IT OUT. SHE COMPLIED WITH, UM, WHAT THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, WHAT THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT TOLD HER SHE NEEDED TO DO. AND ALL SHE ASKED ME TO PUT BACK IN TERMS OF COVERAGE WAS THE SHED. AND AS LONG, AND THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT SAID, YEAH, AS LONG AS YOU HAVE IT FIVE FEET FROM THE PROPERTY LINE, OF COURSE YOU CAN HAVE A SHED UP TO 150 SQUARE FEET. SO THAT'S WHAT THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, UH, SUBMISSION REPRESENTS. AND OF COURSE, THERE'S OTHER ITEMS THAT WE NEED TO DO IN THE HOUSE, LIKE A, A HEADER FOR A BAY WINDOW. BUT THAT'S THAT WE NEED TO, WE NEED TO GET THE APPROVAL HERE BEFORE WE CAN MOVE OKAY. AND GET A BUILDING PERMIT. OKAY. YES. I, I AM VERY CONFUSED FROM THIS PRESENTATION. UM, THE PHOTOS THAT WE ARE LOOKING AT, SAY, IS THE VIOLATION. IT LET ME FINISH. OKAY. PREEXISTING CONDITION. SO THIS SHED, THAT'S NINE BY 21 THAT IT, THIS CONDI, THIS SHED. THAT'S NINE. THIS WAS REMOVED. THAT WAS REMOVED. ALL THE I'D LIKE YOU SEE THERE WAS REMOVED ALL THE STONES ON THE, ON THE GROUND. ALL OF THAT IS REMOVED. CORRECT. SO, CORRECT. RIGHT NOW IT IS AN EMPTY BACKYARD WITH NOTHING IN IT. NO, IT HAS, I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S THERE. YEAH. OKAY. OKAY. THAT WE NEVER SAW THAT BEFORE. THAT'S NOT IN ANYTHING THAT WAS SUBMITTED TO US. OKAY. I TOLD IT WAS REMOVED. THAT'S WHAT HE LOOKS AT. LET ME MOVE . OKAY. SO TH THIS IS ALL, THIS IS ALL, IT'S ALL OPEN RIGHT NOW. SO HOW MUCH ARE THERE IS, OKAY. HOW MUCH MORE ARE WE GONNA PUT BACK? WITHIN THE FIRST ONE? AND YOU'LL SEE THAT THE FOOTPRINT OF THE SHED. AND THAT'S IT. THAT'S BASICALLY IT. WHAT'S THIS? SHE IN THE, IN THE PICTURE. IS THAT THE OLD ONE? THAT'S THE OLD ONE THAT'S GOING OUT. SO, OKAY. DO YOU HAVE, I MEAN, CAN YOU, CAN YOU GET ONTO THIS? THIS, UM, COULD YOU GO TO THE LEGALIZATION FOR WHATEVER THIS, THIS PAGE, ALL OF THIS WAS REMOVED. OKAY. OKAY. IT'S ON THE SAME PAGE AS THE PHOTOS. OKAY. OKAY. THAT LAST PAGE. WAIT, NO, SHE'S TRYING, I'M TRYING TO, WHICH IS THE CONDITION? BECAUSE THIS IS, WHAT HE'S SAYING IS, AND I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE PUTTING BACK IN A SHED. 10 BY 15. BUT IS ANY, IS ANY OF THE GROUND AREA GOING TO BE COVERED? WELL, ON THAT PICTURE, SOME OF IT IS STILL THERE. NO, THIS PICTURE IS REMOVED. OH, NO, NO, NO, NO. THE OTHER ONE OF WHAT'S GONE. OKAY. AT THE BOTTOM, AT THE FOOT OF THE STAIRS, THERE IS SOME CONCRETE, THERE IS SOME OTHER, WELL, THERE'S A LANDING PLATFORM THERE, WHICH IS ON THE DRAWING AND IS PART OF THE COVERAGE. SO WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO ASK YOU TO DO IS TO, OH, OKAY. WHAT I'D LIKE YOU TO DO IS IF YOU CAN, UM, EVEN IF YOU COME UP HERE OR WHATEVER ELSE AND SHOW US WHAT IS IT THAT WILL BE THERE, BECAUSE NORMALLY WE GET A PICTURE, A DRAWING OF WHAT IS AND AN, [00:15:01] AND A DRAWING OF WHAT IS PROPOSED. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE ASKING. THIS IS WHAT'S THERE. THAT'S WHY I'M TELLING YOU THERE'S A PICTURE OF NOTHING. THERE'S NOTHING THERE. OKAY. THERE IS NOTHING THAT SAYS, PROPOSED TO SHOW YOU WE'RE PUTTING A SHED. THAT'S IT. OKAY. I THINK THAT IS THIS DRAWING. I'M TRYING TO FIND OUT WHAT DRAWING IT IS. THE FIRST ONE. THIS ONE RIGHT HERE. BUT I'M LOOKING AT THE LAST PAGE. THIS ONE, THE PHOTOS. THIS ONE. AND YOU SAID THIS SHED HAS ALREADY BEEN REMOVED. YES. AND YOU WANT A VARIANCE TO PUT A DIFFERENT SHED IN. YES. RIGHT HERE. BIGGER, SMALLER, 10 BY 15 WE'RE ALL ALLOWED BY CODE. OKAY. UP TO 150 SQUARE FEET. OH, SO IT'S SMALLER. SO YOU GET LESS COVERAGE. YES. THE THE, THE NATURE OF, OF MY PRESENTATION, I, I, I WANTED YOU TO UNDERSTAND THAT WHEN THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT SAID THERE, WENT THERE AND GAVE US A VIOLATION, SHE TOOK EVERYTHING OUT. WE UNDERSTAND THAT PART. YES. WE DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT'S GOING IN. THIS PAGE IS THE ONE THAT SHOWS YOU SEE THE, YOU SEE THE, THAT'S OLD WE BUILDING. THAT'S THE FIRST PAGE. IT'S TOO SMALL FOR YOU TO SEE IT. IT'S THE LAST PAGE. OKAY. AND, OKAY. AND YOU'RE SAYING THAT IT'S NOT IT, I'M JUST, I'M TRYING. THERE THERE'S ALSO SHOWING, UM, NO, THAT'S PART OF THE ORIGINAL HOUSE. THAT'S, THAT'S THE HOUSE. THE HOUSE HASN'T BEEN TOUCHED OR ADDED TO. CAN I ASK A QUESTION? IF YOU DIDN'T PUT IN THE SHED, OKAY, WHAT WOULD THE IMPERVIOUS SURFACE COVERAGE BE? IT WOULD BE 150 DIVIDED BY THE AREA OF THE LOT MINUS, UH, SO I WOULD SAY IT WOULD BE 61. 62% RATHER THAN 70 SOMETHING. SO IT WOULD STILL BE INVITED? YES. CORRECT. THE HOUSE. THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. NO MATTER WHAT WE DO. YES. SO IT'S ABOUT 10% MORE. THAT'S WHY IT'S A GOOD QUESTION. NO MATTER WHAT WE DO, IF WE TOOK EVERYTHING OUT, WE STILL, THE PRESIDENT, WE'RE STILL IN VIOLATION. THAT'S CORRECT. I WAS OVER THERE TODAY ACTUALLY. AND GOING AROUND THAT NEIGHBORHOOD, THE HOUSES THAT WERE BUILT IN THAT TIME, THEY'RE STILL THERE ON THESE LITTLE LINING. TINY LOTS. YES. YES. I MEAN, THIS HAPPENS TO BE A LARGE HOUSE. YES. BUT THE HOUSE NEXT DOOR IS LARGE. AND THERE'S ANOTHER ONE THAT YOU KNOW. YEAH. BUT THIS IS JUST HOW IT WAS. YEAH. THAT THAT'S, YEAH, THAT'S RIGHT. THEY, THEY'RE ALL, WE ALWAYS SEE THESE KINDS OF PROJECTS. AND I, IN MY OFFICE, I ALWAYS HAVE TO DEAL WITH IT. I ALWAYS END UP PULLING IN THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, WHAT CAN I GET AWAY WITH? WHAT IS THIS? WHAT IS THAT? AND THEY, THEY ALWAYS SAY, WELL, LOOK AT THE, NOTHING HAS CHANGED. WHATEVER THE COVERAGE IS, THAT'S IT. GET A GOOD SURVEY AND, AND COUNT THE AREA. AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE. BUT YOU'RE RIGHT, THOSE HOUSES ALL HAVE A VERY LIMITED, UM, AND I CAN'T SAY THAT THE COVERAGE A MAXIMUM OF 43 IS, IT'S A LITTLE TIGHT. LIKE I SAID, HALF OF THE LOT, YOU'RE ALLOWED TO PAVE ONLY HALF OF THE LOT. BUT BY THE TIME YOU TAKE THE AREA OF THE HOUSE, THE DRIVEWAY AND THE WALKWAYS, YOU, YOU'RE ALMOST USING UP 50% OF THE LAND. CAN I ASK YOU A QUESTION? UH, TO THE SIDE OF THE HOUSE, THE SIDE THAT'S NOT ALMOST ON THE LOT LINE. IT, IT SEEMS TO BE THAT THE, FOR THE FULL LENGTH OF THE HOUSE, IT'S CONCRETE. THAT'S, THAT'S THE, THE OLD, WELL, IT'S PROBABLY, UH, THE PAVEMENT. I DON'T REMEMBER. CONCRETE OR ASPHALT. I THINK IT'S ASPHALT AS, AND THAT WAS, THAT'S ASPHALT. AS IF YOU, YOU HAVE TO COME UP HERE AND THAT'S OKAY. YOU CAN JUST COME UP AND INTRODUCE YOURSELF. AND THEN SHE'S SCARED. THAT'S OKAY. DON'T BE SCARED. REMEMBER WHAT I SAID, THE ORIGINAL HISTORY OF THE HOUSE IS WHEN SHE BOUGHT IT, THAT DRIVER WAS THERE AND THERE WAS A BIG 22 BY 21 SQUARE FOOT, UH, DIMENSION GARAGE ON THE REAR OF A SURVEY OF IT. IF YOU WANT TO SEE IT. WE, WE UNDERSTAND THAT SHE BOUGHT NO, BUT I'M JUST SAYING THE DRIVEWAY. BUT WE UNDERSTAND THAT WHAT SHE BOUGHT WAS EXTREMELY NOT CONFORMING. WE'RE NOT HERE TO DISCUSS WHAT SHE BOUGHT. WE'RE NOT ALLOWED TO, WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THIS AS A BRAND NEW APPLICATION REGARDLESS OF WHAT EXISTED WHEN IT WAS PURCHASED. SO THAT'S ALL WE'RE TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WHAT'S THERE. AND IT'S, I UNDERSTAND YOU'RE TRYING TO GET THERE, BUT WE NEED IT DONE IN A NO, NO. WE UNDERSTAND EVERYTHING. I'M JUST SAYING THAT THEY, WHAT HE ON. I LET, CAN WE ASK THE HISTORY OF IT THAT IT WAS A DRIVEWAY THERE ALWAYS, WE DIDN'T CREATE THE DRIVEWAY. THAT'S WHY I WANTED TO SAY THAT. HI, MAY I APOLOGIZE. I, MY ENGLISH IS NOT PERFECT, BUT I TRIED TO EXPLAIN TO YOU QUESTION. OKAY. CAN YOU STATE YOUR NAME? MY NAME IS CARMEN IAMA. MY ADDRESS IS 22 BEACH STREET, TEN SIX ZERO THREE. AND WHAT DO YOU, WHAT DO YOU USE THE DRIVEWAY FOR? ALWAYS FOR PARK. MY CAR, MY CAR, MY DAUGHTER CARS, MY CAR. [00:20:01] NO. 'CAUSE THE DRIVEWAY GOES FROM ALL THE WAY FROM THE FRONT, FROM THE STREET TO THE BACK OF THE HOUSE. I'VE ORDERED A PROPERTY LIKE THAT. I I UNDERSTAND THAT. NOTHING I DO NEW. BUT YOU'RE ASKING US TO MAKE MORE PROPERTY, MORE OF THE LAND IMPERVIOUS. SO CAMP THROUGH WATER CAN'T GO THROUGH. SO I'M TRYING TO, UNDER YOUR DRIVEWAY. THE DRIVEWAY ENDS RIGHT HERE. WE'RE NOT GOING THROUGH THE BACK. THE DRIVEWAY ENDS RIGHT THERE. I UNDERSTAND THAT, SIR. I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND HOW LONG THAT DRIVEWAY IS. AND IT'S PROBABLY, YOU KNOW, IT'S THE LENGTH OF THE HOUSE PLUS THE FRONT LAWN. IT'S PROBABLY A HUNDRED FEET, A HUNDRED MINUS 29. SO IT'S, IT'S 71 71 FEET. DO YOU USE THE ENTIRE DRIVEWAY? YES. IS IT, I'M TRYING TO OFFSET, I'M TRYING TO SEE IF THERE'S A WAY TO OFFSET WHAT THIS SHED IS DOING BY MAYBE SHORTENING THE DRIVEWAY OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT SO THAT THERE'S NOT SUCH A LARGE PERCENTAGE INCREASE. BUT YOU IMPERVIOUS COVER, HATE TO INTERRUPT YOU, BUT YOU, THIS IS, THIS IS A TWO FAMILY HOUSE. IS IT A TWO FAMILY HOUSE OR A THREE FAMILY HOUSE? TWO FAMILY HOUSE, YES. OKAY. TWO FAMILY. AND CAN'T, AND YOU CAN'T PARK ON THE, YOU KNOW. CORRECT. AND THAT'S, I'M JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND IT. YEAH, NO, NO. WE NEED FOUR SPACES. THAT'S WHAT THE, AND IT'S ALREADY 62%. RIGHT. SO YOU'RE TALKING 10% MORE AT 73%. SO IT'S NOT, YES, IT IS AN INCREASE, BUT IT'S NOT, IT IS NOT A VERY LARGE INCREASE. I, I GET, I'M JUST TRYING TO GET A FULL UNDERSTANDING. AND SO THE ISSUE IS YOU NEED FOUR PARKING SPACES THAT WASN'T STATED. NOW IT MAKES SENSE. SAY THAT. YES. YES. OKAY. NOW THAT MAKES SENSE. THAT'S A MORE REASONABLE WAY OF SAYING IT. OKAY. WE, WE'VE GOTTEN ALL THE ANSWERS, BUT NOT IN THE RIGHT ORDER. YEAH. . SO IN, IN THE APPLICATION, IT SAYS THAT ONE OF THE ISSUES IS THAT THE LOT SIZE IS 3,750 INSTEAD OF 5,000 FEET. HOW DOES THAT PLAY INTO THE SECTION? WELL, IF WE, IF WE HAD A 5,000 SQUARE FOOT AND WE MULTIPLY THE, THE, IF, IF WE COUNTED THE AREA AND DIVIDED IT BY THE SAME AREA OF IMPERMEABLE DIVIDED INTO 3000, EACH CHANGE WOULD GIVE YOU A HIGHER PERCENTAGE THAN IF WE DIVIDED INTO 5,000. THAT'S WHY THAT STATEMENT IS . RIGHT. BUT NOW THAT MADAM CHAIR HAS MADE THAT STATEMENT, AND I, I, I REALLY SHOULD HAVE MENTIONED THAT, THAT YOU NEED, UH, A, A, A PLACE TO, TO PARK FOR FOR FOUR HERE. AND THAT'S A STRUGGLE IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD. EVERYBODY THOUGH IS, YOU KNOW, SEARCHING FOR A PARKING SPOT. , GO BACK OVER THERE. JUST ONE QUICK QUESTION. WHEN, WHEN WAS THE HOUSE BUILT? WHEN WAS THE HOUSE BUILT? I WOULD VENTURE THE VENT TWENTIES. OKAY. AND, AND HOW LONG HAS SHE BEEN THERE? HOW LONG, WHAT HAS SHE OWNED THE PROPERTY? UH, I, I TAKE IT GUESS 10. HOW MANY? NO, I BOUGHT IT 2007. IT'S READY. 20 YEARS. I NEVER, I HAVE THIS PROBLEM LAST YEAR. THEY START THE PROBLEM JUST . OKAY. YOU SAY SET THE PROBLEM FOR WHAT? UH, STOP THE PROBLEM. JUST FOR MY NEIGHBORHOOD. SAID I TRY TO PUT INSULATION IN THE ROOM. SAY LIKE, I GO TO DO NEW ROOM THAT IS NO NEW ROOM WAS THERE ALL THE TIME. SHE START PUTTING INSULATION IN THE BARREL BECAUSE IN THE WINTER TIME, MAKE COLD. THAT'S IT. AND SOMEBODY CALLED TO THE INSPECTOR WHEN THE INSPECTOR WENT THERE, SEE THE SHED AND THEN THEY START THE PROBLEM. YEAH, THAT'S IT. I ASK HIM NOW TO PUT A LITTLE SHED LESS FEET, LIKE A HUNDRED SQUARE FEET IN TOTAL IN THE SHED. THAT IS, THAT IS MY OP MY, UH, OKAY. UH, PETITION. SORRY. OKAY. AND YOU NEED A STORAGE ROOM? AND THE SHED? WELL, THE SHED IS FOR HER TOOLS. SHE'S A CONTRACTOR. OKAY. WHAT'S THE STORAGE ROOM FOR? STORAGE ROOM OF ANY HOUSES, I SUPPOSE, YOU KNOW. OKAY. WAS, I'M SO SORRY. I'M SORRY. I INTERRUPT. WAS THERE FOR ALL THE TIME, UHHUH, I USED TO PUT IN MY, YOU KNOW, TO, TO THINGS TO SALT, YOU KNOW, LITTLE, LITTLE THINGS. YOU TALKING ABOUT STORAGE ROOM? YEAH. STORAGE ROOM. YEAH. BUT I WAS THERE ALL THE TIME. YES. YOUR, YOUR DRIVEWAY RIGHT NOW IS CURRENTLY PAVING STONES, NOT ASPHALT. WE PUT A, A PAVER OVER THE, UH, LATER THE PAVERS. MM-HMM . PAVERS. WE PUT IT NOW. NO, THE DRIVEWAY. THE DRIVEWAY. AND THIS HAS P YEAH, I CAN SEE. YOU SAID IT WAS ASPHALT. MOST OF IT'S WHAT I SAW WAS ASPHALT. I DON'T KNOW IF IT GOES ALL THE WAY BACK THOUGH. NO. ON THE IT DOES. NO, HERE IT IS THAT A, IT LOOKS LIKE PAVERS TO [00:25:01] ME. YES. I KNOW HOW OLD. I DUNNO HOW OLD THIS PICTURE IS. YES, YES, YES, YES. THANK YOU. OKAY. BEAUTIFUL . THAT'S 10 GRAND RIGHT THERE. SO THAT, THAT I WON'T TAKE OFFENSE. UM, BUT THAT LOOKS LIKE ASPHALT OR CONCRETE OR SOMETHING. RIGHT? ACTUALLY BETTER THAN DRIVING, THAN ASPHALT BECAUSE THE WATER INFILTRATES. YEAH. YEAH. IT'S A BETTER JOB TO HAVE THAT. I ALWAYS, I ALWAYS SUGGEST THAT IF, IF THERE'S ENOUGH MONEY, BECAUSE THE WATER TRICKLES THROUGH THE, SO IT IS MORE PERMEABLE THAN YES. AND THE, AND THE GRAVEL UNDERNEATH. ACCESS STORAGE. WE'RE NOT ALLOWED TO CHANGE THE CALCULATION. NO, BUT IT'S A POSITIVE. IF YOU ALWAYS, IF I ACCEPT, I AM, I'M FULL OF ENERGY. I'VE TAKEN ABOUT THREE DIFFERENT PILLS THIS MORNING. KIDDING. I THINK WANTED SPEAK. I'M EXCITED TO SEE ALL OF YOU AGAIN. I'M EXCITED THAT I'M WALKING 'CAUSE I HAD A BIG BACK OPERATION AND, UM, I'M JUST, YOU KNOW, I'M A TEACHER AT HEART TRYING TO TEACH YOU. WE'LL HAVE HIM COME TO THE MEETING. . OKAY. DO WE NEED ANYTHING ELSE? I DON'T. OKAY. OKAY. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE WANT THANK YOU TO EVERYONE. THANK YOU. YES. ANYONE OUT THERE WHO WANT TO YOU COMING UP? , AREN'T YOU IN THE WRONG PLACE? OKAY. I DIDN'T WANNA INTERRUPT. WELL, COME ON UP. , COME ON. IS THERE ANYONE SITTING OUT THERE WHO WANTS TO HAVE ANYTHING TO SAY ABOUT THIS? FOR THE RECORD, MR. BLAND ARRIVED AT APPROXIMATELY EIGHT, UH, SEVEN 30. YES. OKAY. NEXT CASE. WE HAVE A NUMBER ONE. DO DO THE SIGN. THERE'S A SIGN. OKAY. WHAT'S YOUR NUMBER? 26. 11 26 11. THAT'S GOOD EVENING. GOOD EVENING, MADAM CHAIR AND THE REST OF THE BOARD. MY NAME IS MICHAEL LANG. UM, I AM, UH, THE OWNER OF RA ASSIGNED COMPANY HERE IN HARTSDALE. UM, AND, UH, WE ARE REPRESENTING JONAH TOOLS. WE WERE HERE, UH, FOUR WEEKS AGO. WE KNOW. YEAH, I KNOW. . WE, WE HERE TOO. SORRY. WE, WE HERE. AND, UH, UM, I WOULD LIKE TO, UH, UM, PRESENT SOME REVISIONS TO THE ORIGINAL PLAN. UM, DO WE NEED TO REFRESH THE NO, WE HAVE IT IN FRONT OF US. OKAY. SO WE ONLY HAVE TO TALK ABOUT THE REVISIONS. YES. EXCELLENT. THE REVISIONS ARE THREEFOLD. KIRA, DO YOU YES. SHOW US JUST A MOMENT. THAT'S NOT WHAT I WANTED. DO . SORRY. I OKAY. WHAT YOU WANTED. UM, IS THAT THE FIRST PAGE? I DON'T KNOW THE ORDER THAT YES, THAT'S THE FIRST PAGE. THAT'S THE FIRST PAGE. SO WE, WE ARE LOOKING RIGHT NOW AT THE WEST ELEVATION AND THE, UH, UM, AND THE SIGN THAT WE ARE PROPOSING NOW, UM, MAYBE GO TO THE NEXT PAGE, THEN IT'S A LITTLE EASIER TO, TO SHOW. SO THIS IS THE WEST EL WEST ELEVATION, WHICH CALL IT THE BACK OF THE BUILDING. UM, [00:30:01] ORIGINALLY WE HAD HERE WE HAVE PROPOSED A LOGO, A CIRCULAR LOGO, PLUS THERE WERE JONAH TOOLS. UH, WE HAVE REMOVED THE LOGO AND WE KEPT THE WORD JONAH TOOLS, UH, AND WE SLIGHTLY AND AT, UH, 24 INCHES IN HEIGHT FOR EACH LADDER, WHICH IS, UH, AS FAR AS I REMEMBER, THE MAXIMUM ALLOWABLE SIZE. UM, THAT'S, AND AGAIN, THE, UH, UH, CHANGE THAT WE MADE HERE. WE REMOVED THE ILLUMINATED LOGO THAT GO TO THE NEXT PAGE. LET'S KEEP THE SMOKE OUTSIDE . OKAY. SO, UH, HERE IS THE, UH, UM, PROPOSAL FOR THE EAST ELEVATION OF THE BUILDING. UM, THE EAST ELEVATION OF THE BUILDING BEFORE AND NOW SHOWS A ILLUMINATED CIRCULAR LOGO WITH THE LETTER J, UH, AND THE WORD JONAH. TOOLS. UH, IN THIS CASE, WE HAVE REDUCED THE SIZE OF THE ORIGINAL OF THE, UH, CIRCULAR LOGO FROM 78 INCHES TO 66 INCHES. UH, IF YOU WANNA SHOW THE ELEVATION OR THE RENDERING, UH, SO HERE WE PROPOSE A REDUCED SIZE FOR THE J LOGO. UM, AND, UH, THE LETTERS TO THE LEFT, UH, OF THIS BUILDING, WHICH IS ROUGHLY, I THINK 350 FEET IN, IN WIDTH. UH, THE CHANGE THAT, THAT WE HAVE MADE, OR A SLIGHT ADJUSTMENT, THE LETTERS OR THE WORD DONOR TOOLS WAS ORIGINALLY SHOWN, UH, UH, JUSTIFIED TO THE RIGHT OF THE, UH, PANELING OF THAT BROWN, UH, PART. UH, AND WE HAVE MOVED IT TO, UH, SORRY, TO THE, IT WAS LEFT JUSTIFIED AND WE HAVE NOW MOVED IT RIGHT JUSTIFIED ON THAT PANELING. UH, I CAN SHOW YOU WHY WE DID THIS. UH, KIRA, CAN YOU SHOW THE, UH, PICTURES? THE VIEW? I THINK THE FILE IS CALLED THE VIEWS. THAT'S ME, . BLESS YOU. OKAY. SO, UH, YES, IF YOU GO TO THE LAST PAGE, WE HAVE BEEN THROUGH THESE PICTURES LAST TIME AS WELL. I CORRECTED THE SPELLING. IT NOW SAYS REAR. NOW IT SAYS VIEW FROM NOT OFF. AND THIS IS THE LAST PAGE, UH, WHICH WE ADDED IN ORDER TO GIVE YOU AN IDEA OF THE LOCATION AND THE VIEW THAT, UH, DRIVERS, VISITORS HAVE WHEN THEY COME DOWN CLEARBROOK ROAD FROM BOTH SIDES. SO THE, UH, PICTURE TO MY LEFT IS A VEHICLE APPROACHING THE ENTRANCE TO THIS PART OF THE, UH, UH, PARK. UM, AND THAT'S WHAT THEY SEE THE BUILDING TO THE LEFT. AND YOU SEE THAT, I MEAN, IT'S REALLY TOUGH TO SEE. SO HERE YOU SEE A PORTION OF THE BUILDING. OKAY, WHEN YOU ARE COMING FROM, UH, THE SOUTH, THIS IS WHAT YOU SEE WHEN YOU ARE APPROACHING. I THINK THE, THE ROAD IS GRASSLANDS. IF YOU MAKE A A, A LEFT INTO CLEARBROOK, UH, THEN THIS IS WHAT YOU SEE AT THE INTERSECTION, UH, ENTERING THE, UM, THE PROPERTY OR THAT PART OF THE PARK. SO I FEEL LIKE THESE TWO PICTURES EXPLAIN REALLY, REALLY WELL, RIGHT? YES. THANK YOU. . THESE TWO PICTURES, UH, UH, ILLUSTRATE REALLY WELL. THAT SETBACK OF, UH, ABOUT 200 FEET, I THINK, UH, SORRY, 200 YARDS. UH, MAKES IT REALLY, REALLY DIFFICULT, UH, TO, TO IDENTIFY THE BUILDING FROM THE ENTRANCE TO THIS PORTION OF THE PARK. SO A SMALL SIGN, UH, IS [00:35:01] REALLY, REALLY TOUGH TO SEE. SO WE FEEL THAT THE, UH, UH, PETITION TO INSTALL SIGNAGE THAT IS EXCEEDING THE, UH, UH, LAW OR THE SIGN CODE, UH, IS IN OUR, UH, VIEWS JUSTIFIED, UH, DUE TO THE LOCATION OF THE BUILDING AND THE, UH, THE NECESSITY TO, UH, GUIDE VISITORS, BE IT, UH, UH, DELIVERIES, UH, BE IT OTHER, UH, TRUCKS, UH, TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY FIND AND SEE AND FIND THE BUILDING RIGHT AWAY. CAN I ASK A QUESTION? YES. SO IF IT'S A VISIBILITY ISSUE, YEAH. WHY ARE YOU PUTTING THE SIGN ON THE PLACEMENT OF THE BUILDING ON THE PLACE THAT'S BEHIND THE TREES INSTEAD OF OVER WHAT LOOKED THE GRAY AREA THAT LOOKS LIKE THE FRONT DOORS THAT IS MUCH MORE VISIBLE FROM THE STREET? WELL, WE PUT THE J LOGO RIGHT OVER THE FRONT DOOR OF THE BUILDING. SO THAT'S THE CORNER OF THE BUILDING, HOW YOU SEE IT. OKAY. SO YOU SEPARATED THE WORDS OF YOUR LOGO, ONE FROM YOUR EBU, YOUR EXTRACTABLE BRAND UNIT, AND THEN WANT TWO SIGNS. DO YOU HAVE A VERSION THAT HAS THE J AS PART OF THE WORDS LIKE THE FIRST J AND THAT YOU COULD HAVE ONE SIGN MORE VISIBLE OVER THE DOORS? CAN YOU SAY THAT AGAIN? SO YOU ARE PUTTING IN, YOU HAVE A WORD LOGO, RIGHT? YES. WHICH IS THE NAME OF THE BUSINESS. YES. AND THEN YOU HAVE THE J IN THE BLUE CIRCLE, WHICH IS THE EXTRACTABLE BRAND UNIT. THE EBU. YES. AND YOU'VE SEPARATED THEM OUT. IS THERE A VERSION WHERE THEY BOTH APPEAR TOGETHER? SO THE J AND THE FIRST WORD, AND THEN YOU COULD PUT IT ALL TOGETHER IN ONE PLACE THAT'S MORE VISIBLE. LET ME INTRODUCE NUMBER ONE. OH, WHERE ARE YOU? YEAH, I'M HERE. YEAH, SO, SO THAT'S RICH, RICH GERBERG. HE IS THE, THE OWNER. I'M THE CEO AND I'M THE OWNER OF THE COMPANY. AND, AND, WELL, THIS IS A FORMER DINNER THEATER. AND JUST SO YOU'RE AWARE, SO THIS IS PART OF A MAJOR DEVELOPMENT. ROBERT MARTIN DEVELOPMENT, WE BOUGHT THIS BUILDING FROM THEM. I DON'T HAVE MY NAME. THERE'S SIGNS FOR EVERY OFFICE, EVERY BUILDING. SO THERE'S NO SIGNAGE FOR US. AND THE BUILDING'S BUILT, EVERYTHING IS DONE. IT'S JUST, WE'RE WAITING TO GET THE SIGN. AND THERE'S NO ONE ELSE. I'M JUST, JUST SO YOU'RE AWARE, THERE'S NO ONE ELSE THERE THAT'S LOOKING. AND SO IT'S REALLY HARD TO SEE FROM THE STREET. AND, AND THE BUILDING IS DESIGNED FOR THAT. JAY AND ARD, IT'S ALL BUILT ALREADY. YEAH. LIKE, I MEAN, THIS WAS ALL PART OF THE DESIGN THAT WE DESIGNED, YOU KNOW, LONG AGO. OKAY, I UNDERSTAND THAT. I'M JUST YEAH, UNDERSTAND, I UNDERSTAND THAT. YEAH. BUT WHAT YOU'RE DOING THEN IS PROPOSING TO PUT UP TWO SIGNS, RIGHT? ONE IS A J IT'S NOT ONE SIGN, IT'S TWO SIGNS. BECAUSE I'M ASSUMING THAT BLUE DESIGN, THE RULE THAT YOU HAVE BETWEEN THE TWO IS NOT PART OF THE LOGO, IT'S PART OF THE BUILDING DESIGN. YES. THIS MIGHT BE EASIER TO SAY YES. MM-HMM . OKAY. THE BLUE LINE. YES, WE HAVE THAT. YES, I HAVE IT. WHAT I AM WHAT I'M SAYING IS, IS YOU'VE ACTUALLY MADE IT MORE DIFFICULT FOR VISIBILITY BECAUSE YOU PUT THE NAME OF THE BUILDING BEHIND THE TREES WHEN YOU'RE DRIVING UP. RIGHT. VERSUS PUTTING IT THE NAME OF THE COMPANY. AND IF YOU WANTED BOTH, IF THERE'S A VERSION OF YOUR LOGO THAT HAS THE J WITH THE CIRCLE, WITH THE NAME OF THE COMPANY, AFTER, AFTER IT, YOU WOULD ONLY NEED ONE SIGN IN THAT ONE PLACE. OKAY. SO IF I CAN ANSWER THAT. SO FIRST OF ALL, THE BUILDING IS 31 FEET HIGH. IT'S VERY, VERY HIGH. OKAY. SO WHEN YOU TURN ON THAT STREET OR WHEN YOU TURN INTO CLEARBROOK, UM, THERE'S NO TREE THAT'S GONNA BE BLOCKING IT. THAT'S, THAT'S NOT REALLY THE ISSUE. YOU'RE GONNA JUST GO IN THERE AND THEN PEOPLE ARE GONNA KNOW THE NAME OF THE BUILDING AND THERE'S TRUCKS THAT ARE COMING IN AND IT'S JUST THE NAME OF THE COMPANY. AND THERE WOULD BE NO WAY FOR US TO PUT A JOE YARD SIGN ON THE LEFT, BUT IT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER. 'CAUSE YOU COULD ALSO COME IN, THERE'S ANOTHER ENTRANCE ON THE OTHER SIDE. IT CAN COME IN AS WELL. THERE'S TWO ENTRANCES IN, SO THERE'S A COUPLE ENTRANCES. SO END BUILDING IS VERY, VERY HIGH. SO YOU COULD SEE IT FROM THAT SIDE AS WELL. OKAY. BUT WHAT YOU, BUT WHAT YOU'RE DOING, OKAY, FROM A STRATEGIC BRANDING POINT OF VIEW IS YOU SEPARATED YOUR CIRCLE LOGO. RIGHT? OKAY. LIKE FROM YOUR BRAND MARK, WHICH IS THE NAME OF YOUR COMPANY, AND PUT UP TWO SIGNS, RIGHT? AND THEN YOU'RE, YOU'RE ASKING FOR A VARIANCE FOR THOSE. AND IS THERE ONE WHERE YOU, WHERE IT'S TOGETHER, RIGHT? WHERE YOU COULD HAVE THEM WHERE THE, THE J 'CAUSE WHAT YOU'RE DOING IS YOU'RE THEN ASKING FOR MORE SIGNAGE THAT YOU REALLY NEED. IT'S REALLY THREE SIGNS YOU'RE ASKING. YES. 'CAUSE YOU'RE ASKING FOR ONE ON THE BACK TOO. [00:40:01] SO THE, DO YOU WANNA SAY, SO WHY DON'T YOU, I MEAN, BECAUSE I MEAN, THIS WAS DESIGNED FOR YEARS AGO. ALL YOU MEAN IS, I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT YOU DIDN'T DESIGN IT WITHIN. SHE'S OUR ARCHITECT, OUR ZONING. OKAY. HI, WILLIAM KU, UM, PETER GADO AND ASSOCIATES ARCHITECT. UM, THE REASON FOR SPLITTING UP THE LOGO WAS PRIMARILY DUE TO AESTHETICS. AS YOU CAN SEE ON THAT, UH, EAST ELEVATION, YOU SEE THERE'S THAT LARGE WINDOW. AND IF THERE, WE TRIED VARIOUS OPTIONS WHERE WE HAD THE LOGO WITH THE LETTER, WITH THE, WITH THE LETTERING. BUT THAT DOESN'T LOOK AS, UH, AS NICE AESTHETICALLY, BECAUSE THE SCALE OF THE WINDOW AND THE SCALE OF THE LOGO WOULDN'T QUITE MATCH. SO WHAT WE'RE DOING IS WE'RE PUTTING THE, THE LOGO ON THE CORNER OF THE BUILDING. SO WHEN YOU DRIVE UP, YOU CAN SEE IT. AND THEN DONARD TOOLS IS A LETTERING THAT YOU ALSO SEE AS YOU DRIVE AND WALK, UH, COMING ONTO THE, COMING ONTO THE ROAD. SO I DON'T KNOW IF THAT ANSWERS YOUR QUESTION. IS THIS THE FRONT DOOR? NOT THE ONE I SAW IT. YES. THIS IS THE SIDE WITH THE FRONT DOOR. YES. YEAH, THERE'S, THERE'S, YEAH. YES. SO THE FRONT DOOR IS NOT WHERE IT SAYS JOAN R TOOLS? NOPE. NO, NO. IT'S WHERE THE, THE, IT'S WHERE THE EBU, THE DOOR IS MORE OR LESS BELOW THE J. YOU CAN SEE IT ON THE RENDERING. I SEE. WHERE IS IT? WHERE IS IT? RIGHT HERE? YEAH. YEP. THAT'S, SO THIS IS YOUR FRONT DOOR? THE FRONT DOOR IS, SO THERE'S A, UNDERNEATH THE LARGE WINDOW, THAT'S WHERE THE FRONT DOOR IS. SO I HAVE A, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE PRINCIPAL. SO YOU DON'T DO RETAIL HERE, CORRECT? ABSOLUTELY NOT. OKAY. ABSOLUTELY NOT. SO WHO IS COMING TO YOUR FACILITY? IT'S MY EMPLOYEES. YEAH. BUT THEY KNOW WHERE THEY WORK, THE TRUCKERS THAT COME TO PICK UP AND DELIVER FOR US. OKAY. AND ONCE IN A WHILE WE'LL HAVE, UM, YOU KNOW, POTENTIAL, YOU KNOW, CUSTOMER, NOT CUSTOMERS, OUR DISTRIBUTORS, YOU KNOW, THAT PEOPLE WE WORK WITH WILL COME VISIT US AT OUR FACILITY OR YOU KNOW, OUR SUPPLIERS. BUT WE DON'T, WE DON'T YOU DON'T MANUFACTURE TOOLS. WE DON'T MANUFACTURE THAT. SO THEY'RE MANUFACTURED ELSEWHERE? THEY COME TO YOUR FACILITY? IT'S MOSTLY DISTRIBUTION. IT'S MOSTLY DISTRIBUTION. OKAY. AND WE HAVE A WAREHOUSE. IT'S, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE A WAREHOUSE. YOU KNOW, IT IS THE OLD DINNER THEATER. SO WE MM-HMM . FIXED UP THE ENTIRE BUILDING, MADE A BEAUTIFUL OUTSIDE SPACE. IT'S THE MOST BEAUTIFUL BUILDING IN THE PARK. IT'S A BEAUTIFUL BUILDING AT THE EDGE OF THE PARK. THERE'S NO ONE, PLEASE. I'M SORRY. OH, I'M SORRY. IT'S, IT'S IN, IT'S AT THE EDGE, EDGE OF THE PARK. LIKE ROBERT MARTIN DIDN'T WANT TO GET, YOU KNOW, THEY, THEY EVENTUALLY SOLD IT TO ME. SO IT'S THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE. THERE'S NO ONE AROUND THAT SAID, IF YOU DRIVE THERE, YOU'LL SEE THAT IT'S A, IT'S A SOLE SPACE AT THE EDGE OF THE PARK. SO IT DOESN'T INTERFERE WITH ANYONE. NO ONE SEES ANYTHING THERE. IT'S BEHIND OTHER, OR SET OFF IN THE BACK. AND ON THE OTHER SIDE IS A HOTEL THAT'S BLOCKED THAT'S, YOU KNOW, DOWN BELOW US. SO THERE'S NOTHING THERE. SO A TRUCKER WOULD COME TO YOUR COMPANY, PICK UP TOOLS AND TAKE THEM WHERE THEY PICK UP UPS. WE SHIP OUT UPS OR FEDEX OR LTL. THEY COME AROUND THE BACK AND THEY PICK UP EVERY DAY THEY DO A DELIVERY. AND YOU KNOW THEY HAVE, AND THEY GOTTA FIND OUT WHERE, THEY GOTTA KNOW WHERE AND WHO WE ARE IN THE BUILDING. THEY GOTTA SEE THE NAME. LIKE, YOU GOTTA KNOW IT'S THE NAME OF THE COMPANY AND WHERE IT IS. 'CAUSE IT'S A COMPLEX WITH LOTS. EVERY OTHER PART OF THE COMPLEX HAS NAMES. BUT WE'RE NOT PART OF ROBERT MARTIN ANYMORE. WE BOUGHT, WE, WE BOUGHT THE BUILDING. LIKE EVERY OTHER PART. IF YOU DRIVE IN THAT PARK, YOU WILL SEE THAT EVERYONE HAS A NAME. WE DON'T. IT'S JUST, YOU KNOW. ARE AREN'T YOU ENTITLED TO A NAME? NO, IT'S JUST THE 'CAUSE WE'RE NOT PART OF IT. SO IT'S JUST, JUST A STREET SIGN. IT JUST SAYS 75 CLEAR PARK. BUT THEY ALL HAVE THESE LITTLE I KNOW, BUT THAT'S, YOU CAN'T DO THAT. NO. THAT'S BECAUSE OF ZONING OR FOR SOME OTHER VEHICLE. IT'S JUST WHAT THEY HAD THERE WITH THEIR AGREEMENT WITH 'EM. THEY'RE JUST SUING THE 75. YOU CAN GO THERE AND SEE YOURSELF. THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. THE SIGN. WHAT? THE SIGN? YEAH. THE SIGNAGE HERE. THE STREET SIGN THAT THEY HAVE. ROBERT MARTIN. SO YOU'RE SAYING THAT DOESN'T DO THE TRIP? YEAH. SO IT JUST SAYS 75. BUT IT'S, I MEAN, YOU NEED A SIGN ON. I GOTTA KNOW. BUT YOU'RE ALLOWED TO HAVE A SIGN ON THE BUILDING. IT'S JUST, YOU WANT ONE THAT'S LARGER AND YOU WANT MORE THAN THIS ALLOTMENT THAT YOU'RE ALLOWED. IT'S 31 FEET. THE BUILDING IS 31 FEET HIGH. THE BUILDING IS HIGH. IT'S NOT LIKE, IT, IT'S NOT LIKE IN INTERFERING WITH ANYONE. IT'S A, IT'S SET BACK. IT'S SET BACK BEHIND OTHER BUILDINGS. WHICH DO YOU THINK IS THE MOST IMPORTANT OF THE THREE SIGNS YOU'RE ASKING FOR? I NEED A SIGN IN THE FRONT AND THE BACK OF MY BUILDING. OTHERWISE, TRUCKERS ARE GONNA BE DRIVING AROUND NOT KNOWING WHERE TO GO. I MEAN, IT'S A DISASTER FOR THE PARK IF PEOPLE DON'T KNOW WHERE IT IS. LIKE YOU HAVE NEW TRUCKERS COMING ALL THE TIME [00:45:01] AND THEY DON'T KNOW WHERE IT IS. IT'S, IT'S NEEDED ALL OVER. AND WE REDUCE THE SIGNAGE SIZE AND AS, AND IF YOU COME AND SEE IT, IF, I DUNNO IF YOU'RE FAMILIAR WITH IT, IT'S DONE. I MEAN, IT'S, IT'S BUILT OUT ALREADY. IT WOULD LIKE , I MEAN IT'S ALL BUILT THIS WHOLE THING OUT. AND I, I DON'T REALLY UNDERSTAND THE ISSUE HERE. OH, OKAY. I, I CAN EXPLAIN THE ISSUE. SURE. THAT WHEN WE WEIGH THIS, IT'S, WE'RE NOT JUST WEIGHING WHAT WOULD LOOK NICE ON YOUR BUILDING. WE'RE WEIGHING THE, THE, THE ZONING CODE THAT HAS TO BE APPLIED AS EVENLY AS POSSIBLE ACROSS THE WHOLE TOWN. I UNDERSTAND. SO THAT, THAT'S THE ISSUE. IT'S NOT, WE'RE NOT JUDGING WHETHER YOUR DESIGN IS PRETTY OR NOT PRETTY. UH, UNDERSTAND. WERE YOU, DID YOU HAPPEN TO KNOW THE ZONING RULES, THE SIGNAGE RULES BEFORE DESIGNING THIS? UM, THAT'S THE ARCHITECT'S QUESTION. ANSWER TO THAT. I, I MEAN, YOU KNOW, IIII HAVE NO IDEA. I MEAN, I SAID IT ALL. I MEAN, BUT CAN I ASK ONE MORE QUESTION ABOUT, UM, THE FRONT? I, I WONDER IF I, IF I KNOW THIS WAS AN ISSUE, OBVIOUSLY I, I DON'T WANT TO SHIFT. DO TRUCKERS HAVE TO GO ON THE FRONT PAST THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING TO GET TO THE BACK LOADING DOCK? THEY DON'T HAVE TO, BUT TRUCKERS GET CONFUSED IN THE PARK A LOT. AND IT'S A PROBLEM. AND YOU HAVE TO EXPLAIN TO 'EM LIKE THE PROPER WAY IS FOR THEM TO GO AROUND AND, YOU KNOW, SO THEY DON'T GO OVER A CURVE. SO IT CAN GET TRICKY THERE. 'CAUSE IT'S, IT'S A BIG PART. OKAY. SO THE ANSWER, SO THE ANSWER IS NO, THEY DON'T HAVE TO GO PAST THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING. THEY DO SOMETIMES. YEAH. SO THE ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION IS, IS THEY HAVE TO GET TO THE, THEY DON'T HAVE TO PASS THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING. THEY DON'T HAVE TO PASS THE FRONT OF BUILDING. BUT THE, THE REAR OF THE BUILDING IS WHAT CITED FROM NINE A OR NO, YOU'RE NOT GONNA SEE IT FROM NINE. I SEE IT. IT'S PRETTY SET BACK. THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. ON THE EDGE OF THE PARK. IT'S, I MEAN OBVIOUSLY IF I KNEW THIS WAS AN ISSUE, I MEAN, AND IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S, I THINK THE QUE I HAVE ONE MORE QUESTION, WHICH IS THE BLUE LINE THAT I SEE GOING AROUND THE BUILDING. IS THAT PART OF THE DESIGN OF THE BUILDING OR JUST PART OF THE LOGO? NO, THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S PART OF THE DESIGN THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE OKAY, SO THAT BLUE LINE AROUND THE BUILDING HMM. IT WAS THERE BEFORE OR YOU, I MEAN IT SEEMS TO BE BUILT INTO THE BUILDING AND THE PIC, EVERY PICTURE I'VE SEEN HAS THAT LINE. YEAH. OTHERWISE IT, THEY WOULD, WOULD BE PART OF THE SAME. SO THAT, THAT'S PART OF THE DESIGN OF THE BUILDING. SO THE LOGO IS TO THE BLUE LINE WITH THE LOGO IS WHAT THE FINAL BUILDING IS WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING TO LOOK LIKE. THE LINE IS PART OF THE BUILDING THAT WAS, THAT WAS SPENT A LOT OF MONEY DOING THESE OUTSIDE STRUCTURE OF THE BUILDING WITH, YOU KNOW, BLUE LINE, THE DIFFERENT, THERE'S THREE DIFFERENT EXTERIORS THAT WE BUILT THAT AS YOU CAN SEE THERE, LIKE THIS WAS VERY, WELL, YOU KNOW, IT WAS VERY WELL THOUGHT OUT AND LAID OUT OR YOU KNOW, IT WAS MY WIFE'S THAT DESIGN . I DIDN'T WANNA SPEND THE MONEY, BUT THAT'S WHAT I DID. NOW THIS IS THE LAST STEP THAT I GOTTA DO ON THIS. IS, IS THIS YOUR ONLY PROJECT IS 21. IS THIS YOUR ONLY LOCATION? THIS IS OUR ONLY LOCATION. SO IN THE PIC IN, IN THE PICTURES THAT YOU SHOWED US, WE ONLY SEE ONE SPOT AND IT LOOKS LIKE FROM BOTH IF THOSE TWO PICTURES, I THINK THEY'RE FROM CLEARBROOK IN THE LAST PAGE OF, OF YOUR PRESENTATION. YEAH. ALL OF THE VIEW. YES. THE VIEW OF WHAT THE DRIVER WOULD SEE. YES. AND IT, AND IT SEEMS TO SHOW THAT THE DRIVER FROM EITHER VIEW OF THE TWO PICTURES YOU SHOWED US, UH, THE ONLY THING THEY'RE GONNA SEE, UM, IF YOU BUILD EXACTLY AS YOU'VE PROPOSED IS THE J IS THAT BASICALLY WHAT WELL, NO, ON THE, ON THIS PICTURE HERE, ON THAT TO THE, ON THE RIGHT YOU SEE THE MICROPHONE. SO THAT'S ONE REASON WHY WE PROPOSED TO MOVE THE LETTERS FROM JUSTIFY TO THE LEFT FURTHER TO THE RIGHT. SO IN WHEN YOU DRIVE INTO THAT PART OF THE PARK, YOU NOW CAN SEE, UH, THAT NAME UH, MUCH, MUCH EARLIER AND BETTER. YEAH. YEAH. BECAUSE AS YOU'RE DRIVING DOWN THAT STREET WHERE THERE'S LIKE AN A DI, THERE'S OTHER A DI AND A DT ARE THERE. AND AS YOU'RE DRIVING IN THERE, THEN YOU'LL CLEARLY SEE AND IT'S HIGH UP, IT'S VERY HIGH UP BUILDING, AS I SAID, 31 FEET. AND WE HAVE SOLAR PANELS. FY SO I MEAN, AGAIN, I I AGAIN, IT'S, IT'S TWO PICTURES. OBVIOUSLY. YOU ARE NOT STANDING THERE AND, AND, AND LOOKING AT IT THAT WAY ONLY IT'S, IT'S, I JUST WANTED TO, TO EXEMPLIFY THAT WHEN YOU'RE DRIVING DOWN CLEARBROOK FROM EITHER DIRECTION, UH, I MEAN IT'S, IT'S FAR BACK. YOU KNOW, THAT'S MOST OF WHAT THESE PICTURES ARE SUPPOSED TO SHOW. 'CAUSE YES. I MEAN YOU MOVE MAYBE A COUPLE OF FEET FURTHER DOWN AND YOU SEE MORE OF THE BUILDING. I MEAN IT'S, IT'S NOT ONLY TREES THERE, BUT THESE PICTURES, [00:50:01] UH, SHOULD SHOW MAINLY, HEY, THIS IS 200 YARDS BACK. SO I MEAN, A LITTLE LOGO ON THE BUILDING IS REALLY NOT, NOT NOT A BIG SIGN. RIGHT. AND AS YOU DRIVE DOWN THAT STREET, THE ONLY THING YOU'RE GONNA HIT IS OUR BUILDING. THERE'S NOTHING ELSE THERE. RIGHT. SO AS WE'RE GOING WITH IT, IT'S JUST US. SO I, IF YOU, IF YOU MAKE THE RIGHT TURN, YOU GET RECONFIRMED, OH, I MADE THE RIGHT. RIGHT. I'M IN THE RIGHT SPOT. SO, SO I JUST HAVE ONE SMALL QUESTION. SURE. BECAUSE HOW YOU'RE OUTLINING THIS, AND I'M NOT READING THIS IN THE ZONING, UM, REQUEST, THE SIGNAGE IS ON TWO SIDES, TWO FACING SIDES OF THE BUILDING OR ON ONE. YES. RIGHT. I WAS GONNA ASK, SO DO WE DO, DO WE SEE THIS SIGN? BUT DO, ARE THEY ENTITLED AS OF RIGHT TO HAVE TWO SIGNS? NO. SO EVEN WHAT WE ARE LOOKING AT RIGHT NOW, 'CAUSE I DO, I THINK THE RENDERING IS VERY NICE AND IT'S VERY AESTHETICALLY MODERN. BUT THE ACTUAL APPLICATION IS MERELY ASKING FOR ONE SIGN. BUT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SIGNAGE ON TWO SIDES FOR WHICH WE ARE NOT EVEN PREPARED TO RULE ON. BECAUSE THE REQUEST IS NOT FOR TWO SIGNS. IT IS, IS IT? MM-HMM. I SEE A TON OF CROSSOUTS ON HERE. LET'S LOOK AT IT AGAIN. WELL I THINK MORE OF THE CONFUSION IS THE, IN THE WAY I LOOK AT, IT'S FOR THREE SIGNS. THE J IS ITS OWN SIGN AND THE DONARD TOOLS. THERE ARE TWO SIGNS LIKE THAT. OH NO, THEY'RE SAYING IT'S ON TWO SIDES, WHICH IS, WHICH WAS DIANE'S POINT IS THAT THE DONARD SIGNS AND THE J ARE NOT ADJACENT TO EACH OTHER AND COME OFF AS THREE DIFFERENT SIGNS. THERE'S THREE, THREE VARIANCES THAT NEEDED. RIGHT. TWO ARE FOR HEIGHT, ONE FOR THE LOGO, ONE FOR THE LETTERING OVER THE FRONT ENTRANCE AND THE ALLOWANCE OF A NON PERMITTED SIGN ON THE REAR OF THE BUILDING. RIGHT. SO TWO WALL SIGNS WHERE ONE IS PERMITTED BUT IT'S REALLY THREE SIGNS. WELL SHE'S TALKING ABOUT THE FRONT FROM EAST ELEVATION. THE EAST ELEVATION HAS, BECAUSE THESE, THE FACT THAT IT SPLIT MAKES IT TWO SIGNS ACCORDING TO THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, WE WOULD'VE OKAY, I SEE. SAID IT'S ONE, BUT RIGHT. SO THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING, THEY WOULD BE, IF THE HEIGHT WAS COMPLIANT, THE LOGO SAY FOR ARGUMENT SAFE WAS FOUR FEET. MM-HMM. AND THE LETTERING WAS 24 INCHES, IT WOULD BE PERMITTED AS A RIGHT. OKAY. 'CAUSE THEY ARE ASKING FOR LARGER HEIGHT. THEY NEED VARIANCES FOR THE LOGO AND FOR THE UM, THE NAR TOOLS. GOT IT. THE REAR SIGN, THEY WOULD NOT BE COMMITTED AT ALL BECAUSE IT'S NOT A TRUE CORNER LOT FRONTING TWO PUBLICLY IMPROVED ROADS. OKAY. THAT'S WHAT I WAS TRYING TO GET AT IS IF THEY ON THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING, PUT THE J WITH IT, THEY WOULD BE WITHIN RIGHTS WITH THE WORD MARK. BUT, AND THEN THEY'D ONLY NEED ONE VARI 'CAUSE THEY'RE GOING DOWN TO 24 INCHES. CORRECT. SO THAT WE'D ONLY NEED ONE VARIANCE FOR AN ADDITIONAL SIGN ON THE BACK OF THE BUILDING. SO THEY WOULD, RIGHT NOW, IF THEY WERE TO REDUCE THE SIGN ON THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING TO CONFORM WITH THE HEIGHT, THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO PUT IT OUT AS IT'S DESIGNED AS IS. BUT EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE TWO SEPARATE SIGNS, THEY'RE ALLOWED TO HAVE SIGNAGE FRONT FRONTING THE PUBLICLY IMPROVED ROOM. MM-HMM . IS THE SIGNAGE ON THE REAR. YES. EVEN THOUGH IT'S COMPLIANT WITH THE HEIGHT AND THE LENGTH THAT THEY, THEY NEED THE EXTRA VARIANCE FOR. OKAY. SO THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN IS A LITTLE, UM, CONFUSING BECAUSE IT SAYS WHERE TWO WALL SIGNS OF PERMITTED THE FRONT, IT SHOULD BE WHERE SIGNAGE IS PERMITTED ON THE FRONT ELEVATION BUT NOT ON THE REAR. OKAY, GOT IT. IF THAT CLARIFIES IT, YES, FOR ME IT DOES. YES. BUT WHO SEES THE REAR EXACTLY? THE TRUCKERS. THE TRUCKERS. OH WOW. IT'S THE TRUCK. IT'S FOR THE TRUCKERS. I MEAN THE TRUCKERS COME, THEY DON'T KNOW WHO IT IS AND, AND THEY'RE COMING, YOU KNOW, DIFFERENT WAYS. 'CAUSE THERE'S DIFFERENT WAYS TO CUT THROUGH. AND YOUR BUILDING DOESN'T LOOK LIKE ANY OTHER BUILDING OUT THERE. YES, THAT'S TRUE. NO, IT REALLY IS. NO, NO, NO. THANK YOU. BUT THE ISSUE IS THE TRUCKERS DON'T KNOW WHEN THEY'RE GETTING THERE UNTIL THEY SEE. WELL THAT'S WHY I ASKED. YEAH. CAN THEY, 'CAUSE IF THEY HAD TO GO PAST THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING YEAH, THEY, THEY'RE NOT. YEAH, THEY'RE NOT GONNA SEE IF THEY DON'T YEAH, THEY DON'T. THEN THEY, I MEAN IT'S, IT'D BE VERY DIFFICULT FOR THEM TO, IF THEY END UP THAT WAY. I BEEN THERE ONE DAY WHEN THE TRUCKER TRIED TO NAVIGATE TO THE FRONT. I MEAN IT WAS A, WELL THEY HAVE AND THEY GO THEN IT'S A PROBLEM. THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO GO THROUGH THE BACK AND WE TRY TO TELL WHERE DO YOU HAVE THE J HERE IT, THIS PICTURE IS THE OTHER SIGN AROUND THE CORNER. WHERE? RIGHT THERE? YES. MM-HMM . OKAY. JUST RIGHT BEHIND ME. YEAH, THAT'S, NO, IT'S ON THE OTHER END. IT'S ON THE BACK. IT'S ON THE OTHER SIDE. IT'S BACK. IT'S ON THE BACK. WHAT IS, IF WE GO BACK TO THE PICTURE, IT'S RIGHT. THE BUILDING IS A RECTANGLE. I UNDERSTAND. BUT, OKAY, SO HERE'S FROM THE STREET. SO HERE'S YOUR J OKAY. IS, IS THE OTHER END FRONT HERE OR ALL DOWN HERE? NO, ON THE [00:55:01] SAME, ON THE SAME SIDE OF THE BUILDING, SO TO SPEAK. IT'S EXACTLY AS IT'S SHOWN IN THE, IN THE PICTURE. PETER, SHOW ME THE, SO YOU HAVE YEAH, THAT SO, SO THIS, CAN I RIP IT? SURE. SO IT WOULD BE LIKE THIS ON THIS SIDE YOU SEE THAT UHHUH , IF YOU COME AROUND THE CORNER, YOU SEE THAT AROUND THE CORNER. SO IT IS EXACTLY ON THE SAME. SO IT WOULD BE, IT WOULD BE ON THE CORNER HERE IN THIS PICTURE? YES. YES. IT'S JUST AROUND THE CORNER. BUT YOU'RE NOT DRIVING THIS. YOU CAN'T DRIVE THERE. OKAY. BECAUSE THAT'S, THAT'S JUST GRASS. OKAY. SO YOU CANNOT THIS ? NO, NO. IT'S BACK TO BACK. IF YOU, THE PLAN IS, OH EXCUSE, EXCUSE ME. LET'S MAKE A RECORD. YEAH, YOU GOTTA GET IN THE MIC SO MUCH. YOU GOTTA GET INTO THE MIC GENERALLY. SO IT'S NOT AROUND THE CORNER. IT'S ON THE OPPOSITE SIDE OF THE BUILDING. IF YOU GO ON THE MICROPHONE, HE HAS RECORD. I CAN MAKE A, OH, I'M SORRY. I'M SORRY. IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT AROUND THE CORNER. IT'S THE OTHER, THE OPPOSITE SIDE OF THE BUILDING. EXACT WAY YOU WERE HOLDING. YES. OKAY. AND IT'S A RECTANGLE. YES. THE BUILDING IS A RECTANGLE THERE. IT'S OKAY. THE BUILDING IS A RECTANGLE HERE. PERFECT. THAT'S A GOOD, GOOD VIEW. AND NO ONE SEES ANYTHING IN THE BACK. AND THIS ALSO SHOWS THAT YOU CANNOT PASS THAT SIDE OF THE BUILDING, WHICH IS THE NORTH SIDE OF THE BUILDING. 'CAUSE THAT'S GRASS. RIGHT? YEAH. AND THE TRUCKERS NEED TO SEE THE SIGN 'CAUSE THEY NEED TO GO THERE. OKAY. SO JUST TO HELP YOU UNDERSTAND, WHAT WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO GO FORWARD WITH AT THIS POINT IS ONE, YOU'RE ASKING FOR SOMETHING THAT IS NOT TYPICALLY PERMITTED, WHICH IS TO HAVE A SIGNAGE ON TWO SEPARATE SIDES OF THE BUILDING. THAT'S ONE WE HAVE TO CONSIDER. YEAH. COUPLED WITH THAT, THE ACTUAL SIZE OF THE J ON BOTH SIDES OF THE BUILDING. SO UNDERSTANDING THERE IS NO J ON THE WEST ELEVATION ON THE REAR, ON, ON THE, ON THE REAR OF THE BUILDING. YES. THAT WAS REMOVED. YEAH. SO IT'S JUST THE LOGO THAT'S ON THE, IT JUST SAYS JON ART TOOLS ON THE REAR OF THE BUILDING. ALRIGHT, SO WE GOTTA APPROVE THE JON ART ON THE BACK AND THE HEIGHT OF THE J ON THE FRONT AND THE LETTERS. BEAUTIFUL. THERE YOU GO. YEAH, EXACTLY. THANK YOU. SO, SO THOSE ARE THE THREE THINGS WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO CONSIDER. AND POSSIBLY REDUCING ANY OF THOSE WOULD MAKE OUR DECISION A LOT BETTER. SO FOR THAT, I DID NOT SUBMIT THIS. IF YOU COULD STAY ON THE MIC TOO. JUST SAY YOU'RE GONNA APPROACH THE APPROACH US WITH ADDITIONAL MATERIAL. AND SO YOU CAN RECORD IT. MY EQUIP HMM. SO THAT HE CAN RECORD IT. JUST SAY YOU'RE GOING TO PRODUCE ADDITIONAL EQUIPMENT, UM, UH, UM, RENDERINGS. SO WE, WE WANT TO SHOW YOU, DO WE HAVE MORE? YES. OF THOSE? WE HAVE ONE LEFT FOR OURSELVES. WE HAVE WHAT? I THINK THAT'S MAYBE AN ALTERNATE RENDERING THAT THEY WANT TO SUBMIT. NO, IT'S NOT AN ALTERNATE, BUT WE WANT TO SHOW YOU THE DIFFERENT SIZES. OKAY. SO IF YOU JUST STAY ON THE MIC, CAN WE EXPLAIN WHAT WE ARE AT? MM-HMM. SURE. I'LL EXPLAIN. UH, SO THE FIRST RENDERING THAT YOU SEE IS ORIGINALLY PROPOSED, WHICH WAS THE 76 INCH DIAMETER LETTER, UH, LOGO WITH THE 36 INCH LETTERS. THEN, UH, THE NEXT PAGE YOU SEE IS THE 48 INCH LO UH, LOGO AND THE 24 INCH LOGO LETTERS. AND THEN THE THIRD SHEET IS WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING, WHICH IS THE 66 INCH LOGO WITH 36 INCH LETTERS. JUST SO YOU CAN KIND OF SEE THE DIFFERENCE IN, IN WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE. THANK YOU. SO, SO WE ARE REDUCING IT BY A SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT CONSIDERING OUR ORIGINAL PROPOSED WAS 78 LETTERS FOR THE LOGO, 78 INCHES. DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? AND AND ALSO IT'S IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND THIS IS NOT A STREET ANYONE'S DRIVE. NOT SO I UNDERSTAND THAT. SO PEOPLE, THIS IS IN THE BACK, NO ONE'S GONNA SEE EXCEPT THE PEOPLE THAT ARE GOING TO THIS BUILDING. AND THE PEOPLE IN EV IN THE BUILDINGS ALL IN THE COMPLEX WILL ALSO, THEY DON'T ACTUALLY GO THERE BECAUSE THEY'RE NO ONES ON THE BACK OF THE, ON THE LAST SPOT. I'M SAYING IS IT SETTING A PRECEDENT WITHIN THE COMPLEX? THERE ARE NOT SIGNS ON THE COMPLEX AT THE MOMENT. NO, NO, NO. IN ANY OF THE BUILDINGS. 'CAUSE THEY'RE ALL SHARED AREAS. WE COULD JUST GET ON THE MIC. PLEASE SPEAK TO THE MIC. I'M SORRY. THERE IS NO SIGNS. SO THE MIDDLE ONE, YEAH, THERE'S NO SIGNS IS COMPLIANT AND PROBABLY DOES NOT NEED A VARIANCE. THE MIDDLE ONE. IS THAT ACCURATE? YES. THE MIDDLE ONE WOULD NOT NEED A VARIANCE ON THIS SIDE. THIS IS CORRECT ON THE BACKSIDE. OKAY. BUT WE ALSO WANT TO SHOW [01:00:01] YOU HOW WE FEEL LIKE IT'S VERY THIS DISPROPORTIONATE TO THE SIZE OF THE BUILDING. OF COURSE IT'S, THANK YOU SO ALMIGHTY. THERE YOU GO. THANK YOU. THAT'S NOT A, SO THAT SECOND PAGE IS A VERSION WHERE WE HAVE A 48 INCH J AND 24 INCH TALL LETTERS ACCORDING TO LIZ. THAT WOULD BE COMPLIANT. WE ARE PROPOSING THAT THAT LOOKS A LITTLE WEIRD ON THIS 31 FOOT TALL, 300 SOMETHING FOOT LONG BUILDING. BUT YOU CAN MOVE IT. THAT'S WHY ON PAGE ONE, THAT WAS THE ORIGINAL SUGGESTION FROM FOUR WEEKS AGO. AND WE HAVE, WHICH IS 78 INCH AND 36 INCH TALL LETTERS. WHICH AGAIN, IF YOU LOOK AT THE ENTIRE PRESENTATION, AND I KNOW PETER SAYS WE ARE NOT HERE TO, TO, TO JUDGE PRETTY, BUT AGAIN, THIS DOESN'T LOOK OUT OF PLACE AT ALL. AND YOU SAID THE SIGN WOULD BE NON ILLUMINATED. THE ONLY THING ILLUMINATED IS THE J. OKAY, THANK YOU. THE LETTERS ARE NOT THANK YOU. IS THE ILLUMINATION ILLUMINA ALLOWED BY, BY WRIGHT. OKAY. AND JUST TO COMPLETE ON THE BACK, NO ILLUMINATION WHATSOEVER. SO ARE YOU OFFERING THIS AS WHAT IS YOUR OFFICIAL REASON FOR HANDLING HANDING US THIS? WE WANTED TO MAKE AN EXPLANATION THAT OUR PROPOSAL IS NOT OUT OF PROPORTION. AND HOPEFULLY EVEN CONVINCE YOU THAT THE COMPLIANT VERSION OF 48 AND 24 ON PAGE TWO JUST DOESN'T LOOK RIGHT ON THE BUILDING. UNDERSTANDING THAT THIS IS NOT A, A, A BEAUTY COMPETITION. BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I MEAN THIS IS A ARCHITECTURAL DESI ARCHITECTURAL DESIGNS AND THOUGHT THROUGH, UH, PROJECT, WHICH AGAIN, , IT JUST DOESN'T LOOK RIGHT. OR MAYBE YOU SURE. AND WE DID CHANGE AROUND THE THINGS BASED ON THE LAST MEETING, JUST SO YOU KNOW, WE DID CHANGE AND REDUCE. WE GOT RID OF THE J WE JUST SMALLER IN THE BACK AND NOW WE'RE MAKING THE SIGNS SMALLER IN THE FRONT. I MEAN, WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE THIS ALL WORK FOR EVERYONE. 'CAUSE UH, YEAH. CORRECT. SO, UM, THAT'S WHY WE'RE SUGGESTING THE 66 INCH AS OPPOSED TO WHAT WE ORIGINALLY, UH, PRESENTED, WHICH WAS THE 78 INCH LOGO. I, I HAVE A, A, A QUESTION I DON'T, I CAN'T ANSWER FOR MYSELF. UH, THIS IS 24 INCH, UH, LETTERING. YES. AND IT'S ALSO 24 INCH LETTERING ON THIS VERSION. AND HERE FOR SOME REASON, IT DOESN'T LOOK AS AWFUL, WHICH, AGAIN, WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT THE PRETTY POLICE, BUT AS I SAID HERE, I AGREE WITH YOU THAT THIS DOESN'T LOOK GOOD. WHY DOES IT LOOK BETTER IN THIS VERSION? SO THAT SIDE OF THE BUILDING IS SHORTER. SO IF YOU LOOK AT THE WOOD SECTION, THAT WOOD SECTION IS A LOT LONGER THAN THE BACK BU PART OF THE BUILDING THAT YOU'RE SEEING THAT SPACE. WELL, OKAY. I UNDERSTAND THAT. WE, WE ZOOMED OUT MORE HERE. RIGHT. WE'RE LOOKING AT A SMALL, UH, UH, WE'RE LOOKING FROM FURTHER AWAY. BUT WHEN YOU GET CLOSER, I SUPPOSE YOU, EITHER WAY YOU'D HAVE THE TWO COLORS. 'CAUSE THE, THE BLUE'S ALREADY THERE, THE SIGN WOULD ALREADY BE A DIFFERENT COLOR, SO, OKAY. SO IT'S A, IT'S A SMALLER SECTION OF THE BUILDING THAT YOU'RE SEEING ON THE BACK. YEAH. SO THAT'S WHY IT LOOKS MORE CORRECT WITH THE 24 INCH LETTERS. BUT ON THE, ON THE FRONT, IT, IT'S NOT GONNA LOOK RIGHT WITH ON THE WOOD WHERE WE WANT IT TO BE. OKAY. AND IT'S, IT'S NOT A STREET, IT'S JUST THE PARKING LOT. I MEAN THIS, ALL IT IS IS PARKING LOT. WE ARE, SO WE HAVE FIVE QUESTIONS THAT WE HAVE TO ANSWER WHEN WE, IN ORDER TO JUSTIFY THIS NUMBER. WHAT, OH, YOU MEAN, OH, I'M NOT GONNA ASK YOU THE QUESTIONS. YOU ALREADY, YOU ALREADY FILLED OUT A FORM THAT ASKED YOU THESE QUESTIONS. WAS PART OF THE BUILDING APPLICATION, YOU KNOW, IS, IS, IS THE PROBLEM SELF CREATED? ARE THERE OTHER ALTERNATIVES? THERE'S A BUNCH OF DIFFERENT QUESTIONS. PLEASE UNDERSTAND THAT THIS, THAT OUR DECISION'S NOT GONNA BE BASED JUST ON AESTHETICS AND JUST, OKAY. SO LONG AS YOU UNDERSTAND THAT. 'CAUSE WE HAVE OTHER THINGS WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH HERE. OKAY. [01:05:01] AGAIN, WE WOULD LIKE TO JUST REITERATE THAT WE FEEL LIKE IT'S A, IT, IT'S A ENTIRE PROJECT THAT WE ARE LOOKING AT. AND I THINK IAN AND THE OWNER AND RICH MADE MEANT THAT CLEAR, NUMBER ONE. NUMBER TWO, WE, WE DON'T HAVE, WE DON'T SEE ANY NEGATIVE OR ADVERSE IMPACT ON ANYBODY. I MEAN, WE SEND OUT THE NEIGHBORHOOD, UH, NOTIFICATIONS. NOBODY SPOKE UP. NOBODY CAME UP AND SAID, HEY, THIS IS JUST NOT RIGHT. AND, YOU KNOW, I WILL BE OFFENDED IF I HAVE TO LOOK AT THIS EVERY DAY. I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY ANY ENVIRONMENTAL OR OTHERWISE IMPACT, THERE IS NONE. UM, AND THEN NUMBER THREE, I GUESS RICH MADE OR MADE IT CLEAR THAT THERE ARE FUNCTIONAL ASPECTS TO THAT. AND I HOPE THAT THE PICTURES, THE TWO THAT I TOOK, AGAIN, I WOULD HAVE SHOWED YOU 10 OR 12 OF THOSE. BUT I MEAN, YOU SEE HOW FAR BACK IT IS SET. UH, AND THAT IS AT LEAST ONE IN THE ENTRANCE TO THE PROPERTY. UH, AND FOR SOME OF, AND SOME TRUCKERS WILL NOT TAKE THIS. THEY WILL TAKE ANOTHER ROUTE. 'CAUSE AGAIN, IT IS NOT VERY CONVENIENT FOR, FOR A LONG, UH, TRUCK TO, TO TAKE THIS ENTRANCE AND THEN GO AROUND THE BUILDING. AND THAT'S THE REASON WHY WE SUGGEST A SIGN ON THE SECOND ON THE BACK PART OF THE BUILDING AS WELL. SO THOSE ARE THE THREE THINGS. AND AS YOU KNOW, THIS IS THE SECOND TIME AND WE MADE ALL THE, WE DID MAKE A LOT OF CHANGES BASED ON THE LAST MEETING FROM WHAT WE REALLY WANTED. SO, YOU KNOW, I, I THINK WE'RE REALLY TRYING TO COMPROMISE AND TRY TO FIND A COMMON, COMMON GROUND IF WE CAN. SO, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR THE EDIFICATION OF THE BOARD, WOULD YOU DESCRIBE THE ROUTE THAT A TRUCK WOULD TAKE TO GET TO THE REAR OF YOUR BUILDING WITHOUT PASSING THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING? SO IF YOU'RE COMING, WHERE WOULD THE ACCESS BE? OKAY. UH, DO YOU MIND PULLING OFF OF A TRAVEL ROAD? IF YOU WANNA PULL UP THE SITE PLAN AGAIN? DO YOU WANNA DO THIS ONE? SURE. . SO THEY WOULD BE COMING FROM THE LEFT SIDE OF THE, OF, ON THE SIDE, UM, UH, THE SOUTH SIDE. TECHNICALLY, WHERE WOULD THEY TURN? AND THEN THEY WOULD, IF YOU WANT TO PARTIES JUST SHOW UP. DUNNO WHERE THE ROAD, OOPS, SORRY. SORRY. UH, SO THIS IS WHERE THEY WOULD TURN HERE AND THEN THEY WOULD GO UP WHERE THOSE ARROWS ARE. THEY WOULD GO UP AND THEN TO THE RIGHT. SO THEY'RE NOT GONNA CROSS THE FRONT THIS WAY. THEY WOULD GO UP AND RIGHT. IF THAT MAKES SENSE. SO THEY'RE ON CLEARBROOK, YOU KNOW. RIGHT. SO WHERE YOUR CURSOR IS, THEY WOULD GO UP AND THEN TO THE RIGHT. BUT YOU REALLY CAN'T GO THROUGH THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING. THEY CAN'T. CORRECT. I'VE SEEN IT'S, THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING IS NOT FOR TRUCKS THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING. IT'S NOT FOR NOT FOR TRUCKS. NOT THE TRUCKS ARE NOT FOR THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING. AND THE, AND THE TRUCKS WON'T CROSS THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING IN ANY WAY TO GET TO. THEY, THEY'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO AND THEY SHOULDN'T. AND IT'S NOT GREAT. IF THEY DO, THEY'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO GO IN THAT WAY. AND, AND YOU KNOW, THERE, YOU KNOW, THERE'S, YOU KNOW, IT NEEDS TO GO TO THE BACK OF THE BUILDING. IT NEEDS TO GO TO THE BACK OF THE BUILDING. YOU GUYS GOTTA USE THE MIC. IT NEEDS TO GO TO THE BACK OF THE BUILDING. SORRY ABOUT THAT. THEY WILL NOT, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE TO GO AROUND THAT WAY. AND THAT'S, AND AND AGAIN, THAT'S WHEN THEY GET THERE. THEY'LL SEE THE JOE NORD SIGN. IT CONFUSING ME. 'CAUSE WHAT YOU JUST DESCRIBED IS THEY WOULD COME IN FROM THE LEFT SIDE AND GO UP. AND WHEN THEY CAME IN, THAT'S ONE OF THE SIDES OF THE BUILDING. THAT'S, THERE'S NO SIGN AT ALL. RIGHT. SO, SO ACTUALLY, SO THERE'S TWO WAYS TO DRIVE, THERE'S TWO WAYS TO DRIVE TO THE BUILDING FROM CLEARBROOK ROAD. THERE'S TWO. SO AS YOU'RE ON, UM, WHAT'S, WHAT'S THE MAIN STREET THERE? IT'S THE, THE BIG SLOPE. NINE A WHAT? NINE A IS THE MAIN STREET. GRASSLANDS. RIGHT? GRASSLANDS. GRASSLANDS. SO AS YOU'RE ON, WHEN YOU'RE ON GRASSLANDS, YOU MAKE A EITHER A RIGHT OR A LEFT AT THE LIGHT TO GET INTO THE PARK. INTO THE PARK THAT I'M NOT PART OF. YOU GO INTO THE PARK AND AS YOU COME INTO THE PARK FROM THAT SIDE, THERE'S ONE ENTRANCE, WHICH IS THE FIRST ONE OVER THERE. AND THAT'S WHERE PEOPLE WHO ARE DRIVING A CAR WILL GO, IF YOU'RE DRIVING A TRUCK, YOU'RE GONNA GO TO THE SECOND ENTRANCE. AND THEN WHEN YOU GO INTO THE SECOND, [01:10:01] WELL IT'S A, IT'S A ROADWAY, NOT AN ENTRANCE, BUT THERE'S LIKE A ROAD THERE. UM, WHICH IS TAKE THE MIC. I WILL TAKE THE MIC. SORRY IF THAT YEAH, SORRY ABOUT DOING THAT TO YOU. SO WITH THE, UH, I'M JUST MAKE SURE I GOT MY SIZE. OKAY. SO THE CARS, YOU KNOW, THERE, THIS IS THE ROADWAY HERE. SO CARS GO THAT WAY AND THEN THE TRUCKS COME AROUND THE BACK THIS WAY. SO THE TRUCKS ARE GOING THIS WAY TO THE BACK OF THE BUILDING AND CARS ARE GOING THIS WAY. AND THEN, YOU KNOW, AROUND AND PARKING THERE. SO THERE'S REALLY TWO WAYS. SO CARS GO ONE AND THE TRUCKS GO ON THE OTHER. AND THEN ON CLEARBROOK YOU CAN COME FROM EITHER DIRECTION, YOU KNOW, IT, IT'S A STREET THAT GOES BOTH WAYS. SO, SO THERE'S TWO PATHWAYS. AND THEN IF YOU'RE DRIVING A TRUCK THIS WAY, YOU'LL ACTUALLY SEE THE DONOR SIGN THERE. AND THEN POSSIBLY, BUT NOT REALLY. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'LL, THAT'S HOW YOU SEE IT, BUT YOU'RE COMING THERE AND THEN CARS ARE THAT WAY. SO THAT'S IT. AND THERE'S NOTHING THERE. I'M NOT SAYING BEHIND THERE, IT'S AN EMPTY CORNER SPOT AT THE END OF THE PARK. IF YOU'RE COMING FROM THE MAIN ROAD, WHICH I'M ASSUMING EVERYBODY IS COMING FROM. COMING FROM. SO THE MAIN ROAD, YOU MEAN CLEARBROOK OR GRASSLAND OR? NO, I MEAN, I'M GONNA SAY FROM GRASSLAND. LET ME JUST SEE. I'M GONNA PUT THIS INTO DIRECTIONS THAT I'D GIVE SOMEBODY AND TELL ME IF I'M CORRECT. OKAY. OKAY. SO YOU'RE ON GRASSLANDS, YOU TURN ONTO CLEARBROOK, YOU PASS THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING. AFTER YOU PASS THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING, YOU MAKE THE NEXT POSSIBLE. WELL YOU'RE NOT GONNA PASS MY BUILDING FROM CLEARBROOK 'CAUSE I'M 600 FEET BEYOND CLEARBROOK. THAT'S THE PROBLEM. I'M NOT ON A ROAD. BUT YOUR ADDRESS IS CLEAR CLEARBROOK, BUT YOU CAN SEE IT. WHAT'S THAT? YOU CAN SEE IT FROM CLEARBROOK. I MEAN, I GUESS YOU COULD SEE A FROM YEAH, THAT BUILDING. SOMEWHAT A LITTLE STANDS OUT. I MEAN P PETER IS RIGHT. SO YOU MAKE THAT TURN. YEAH. YEAH. GO THERE. YEAH. CLEARBROOK, YOU PASS THE ENTRANCE WHERE THE PASSENGER CARS ARE SUPPOSED TO GO. AND THEN YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO TAKE THE NEXT POSSIBLE TO THE RIGHT. AND THAT GETS YOU TO THE, THE BACK OF THE BUILDING. I MEAN, IS THERE ANOTHER WAY OF DESCRIBING IT? YOU'RE SAYING YOUR ADDRESS IS CLEARBROOK? THE PEOPLE ARE GONNA GET ONTO CLEARBROOK. YEAH, IT'S CLEARBROOK, WHICH IS REALLY A BAD ADDRESS. SO, 'CAUSE IT SHOULDN'T BE CLEAR. I MEAN THAT'S A, THAT'S ANOTHER PROBLEM IN ITSELF. 'CAUSE IT REALLY SHOULDN'T BE CLEARBROOK, BUT WHATEVER. OKAY, BUT THAT'S YOUR IT'S MY ADDRESS. I'M LIVING WITH IT. YOU HAVE TO GIVE THE TRUCKS. I'M LIVING WITH IT. YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO GIVE THE TRUCKS DIRECTIONS. SO I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND HOW YEAH, YOU, I GOT YOU. DO YOU HAVE A BETTER WAY OF DOING IT? THAT YOU'D BE TELLING THEM WHAT TO DO? IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S, YOU KNOW, THEY, YOU KNOW, YOU TRY TO EXPLAIN WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. THERE IS WHAT IT IS. YOU GO AND, AND IT'S, IT'S THE SECOND, THE TRUCKS ARE THE SECOND ENTRANCE, YOU KNOW, DEPENDING IF TROY, YOU'RE COMING ON CLEARBROOK, SO THE TRUCKS ARE GONNA GO HERE AND THEN THEY'RE GONNA GO THAT WAY. RIGHT. SO THE, THE MOST IMPORTANT SIGN THAT YOU NEED IS ACTUALLY FACING CLEARBROOK BECAUSE THAT WILL IDENTIFY THE PEOPLE. 'CAUSE THEY KNOW, HAVE TO KNOW THEY PASS YOU IN ORDER TO TURN TO GET BEHIND YOU. THEY'RE NOT GONNA BE FIND OUT THAT THEY'RE BEHIND THE BUILDING BY ACCIDENT. SO THEY HAVE TO IDENTIFY THE BUILDING FROM CLEARBROOK IS WHAT I THINK I UNDERSTAND. NOT, NOT REALLY. NOT IF THEY COME FROM THE OTHER DIRECTION. YEAH. IT'S, IT'S, THEY COME, IT'S LIKE IF THEY'RE THERE, THEY, THEY NEED TO KNOW THEY'RE THERE. . OKAY. IF YOU, IF YOU ENTER, IF YOU ENTER THE PARK FROM, FROM, UH, WHAT IS IT? USE THE MIC, SORRY. IF YOU ENTER THE PARK FROM, FROM, UH, FROM CAPTAIN LAWRENCE WHERE, WHERE CAPTAIN, CAPTAIN LAWRENCE IS. RIGHT. AND DRIVE CLEARBROOK TOWARDS THIS, YOU'RE COMING FROM, FROM HERE. SO YOU WILL NOT PASS THE BUILDING. YEAH. AND THAT'S A VERY COMMON WAY FOR TRUCKS TO COME IS BY THE, THAT WAY. WHICH IS WHERE THE, THE BREWERIES ARE MICROPHONE AND THEN YOU TURN MICROPHONE. YEAH, THAT'S A VERY COMMON, THEY'RE COMING FROM THE BREWERY. WHERE DO YOU TELL 'EM TO TURN? HOW DO THEY KNOW WHERE TO TURN? THEY'RE GONNA TURN WHERE THERE, THERE'S A, A DRIVEWAY, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE THAT'S AN ENTRANCE. 'CAUSE THERE'S OTHER BUILDINGS WITHIN THERE. THERE'S OTHER, THEY'RE ALL UNMARKED ENTRANCES? NO, THEY'RE MORE, YEAH, THEY HAVE, WELL THEY HAVE NAMES OR THERE'S, THERE'S A SIGN. I DON'T HAVE A SIGN THERE. THERE'S A SIGN THAT MIGHT SAY 75 CLEARBROOK. BUT IT'S THE NAMES OF EVERYONE'S WHO'S WHATEVER THEY ARE, WHATEVER BUILDING THEY'RE IN, IT'S THE NAME OF THEIR BUSINESS. I DON'T HAVE MY NAME OF MY BUSINESS. IT JUST SAYS 75. SO THERE IS A SIGN YOU NOT ALLOWED THE NAME OF YOUR BUSINESS? THAT'S YEAH, THEY, THEY, THEY WOULD NOT DO IT FOR US. I MEAN, I COULD TRY TO FIGHT 'EM ON IT, BUT YOU KNOW, I DIDN'T, BUT THAT'S NOT BECAUSE I'M NOT PAYING FOR THAT. THAT'S PART OF, I JUST BOUGHT THE BUILDING FROM THEM. SO THE INSTRUCTIONS WOULD BE IF YOU'RE COMING FROM THE BREWERY, MAKE A LEFT TURN AT THE NUMBER 75 AND GO TO THE BACK OF THE BUILDING. YEAH. AND GO, GO AGAIN. GO STRAIGHT TO THE END AND MAKE A RIGHT. TILL YOU GET TO THE SPOT. AND IF YOU'RE DRIVING A CAR, YOU, YOU GO EASIER. IT'S A LITTLE EASIER WITH THE CAR. YEAH. DO YOU HAVE CONTROL OVER YOUR INTERNAL LOT OR IS IT JUST AT THE MAIN ENTRANCE OFF OF CLEARBROOK WHERE YOU'RE NOT PERMITTED TO HAVE A DIRECTIONAL SIGN BY ROBERT MARTIN? UM, [01:15:01] I, I MEAN MY, WHERE MY LOT STARTS IS RIGHT BY THE BUILDING. SO I'M NOT GONNA HAVE A DIRECTIONAL SIGN ANYWHERE. LIKE I DON'T, I DON'T, YOU KNOW, Y BY THE TIME YOU GET THERE, YOU'RE GONNA SEE THE BUILDING. SO FOR PURPOSES OF, AND I THINK THAT'S A CONVERSATION THAT WE MAY NEED TO HAVE WITH ROBERT MARTIN FOR PURPOSES OF FIRE PROTECTION AND IDENTIFICATION. I'M SORRY, WHAT? FOR THE FIRE DE FIRE DEPARTMENT TO LOCATE YOUR BUILDING, IF IT'S CONFUSING FOR A TRUCK DRIVER, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE IS IDENTIFICATION, INCLUDING THE NAME OF YOUR BUSINESS THAT 75 CLEARBROOK IS DI SO, UM, AS OF RIGHT AS MICHAEL IS AWARE, YOU CAN HAVE A SIX SQUARE FOOT DIRECTIONAL SIGN AT EACH INGRESS AND EGRESS OF YOUR, YOUR PROPERTY. OKAY. SO THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE SHOULD PROBABLY TALK TO ROBERT MARTIN AND WE CAN DO THAT IN THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT TO HOPEFULLY GIVE YOU IDENTIFICATION. UM, BUT THE, AS YOU SAID, ALL OF THE OTHER PROPERTIES IN THE CLEARBROOK COMPLEX HAVE THE NAME OF THE BUSINESS AND THE ADDRESS, WHICH IS YEAH. ON THE SIGNAGE ON THE OUTSIDE. AND OURS JUST SAYS 75 CLEARBROOK. THAT'S CORRECT. YEAH. YEAH. OURS JUST SAYS 75 CLEARBROOK. SO THAT'S A CONVERSATION THAT I'M HAPPY TO HAVE WITH ROBERT MARTIN TO SEE IF WE CAN DO SOMETHING RIGHT. BUT YEAH. OKAY. OKAY. THANK YOU. ANYTHING ELSE? NOPE. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ANYBODY OUT THERE HAVE ANYTHING THEY WANT TO PROPOSE? I'M LOOKING TO SEE IF THERE'S ANYBODY. NO. NO. OKAY. DO YOU WANT TO JUST GO RIGHT INTO YEAH, WE CAN, SHOULD WE STAY UP HERE? YEAH, WE HAVE TO LOOK DOWN. ANYBODY WANNA TAKE A BREAK OR NOT? I'M GONNA, I'M OKAY TO GO RIGHT IN. OKAY, LET'S GO. OKAY. SO RECORDING. IT'S STILL RECORDING. STILL RECORDING. STILL RECORDING. ARE WE STILL RECORDING? SO WE GO BACK TO, UH, 26 0 9. THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO RECORD AT 22 BEACH STREET. I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM. I THINK, TO BE HONEST, I'M GOOD WITH THIS. I'M OKAY. I'M GOOD. FOUR. I'M OKAY. OKAY. ALRIGHT. WHO'S GONNA WRITE IT? WE DIDN'T SHOW UP. I SHOULD HAVE BEEN HERE. . ANYBODY WRITE UP, WE HAVE TO WRITE UP? MM-HMM . YOU ARE THE BEST. OKAY. TO START, START OFF ON 26 11. I THINK GIVEN THE OPPORTUNITY FOR THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT TO REACH OUT TO THE REALTOR, UM, I THINK THE MORE FEASIBLE SOLUTION MAY BE DERIVED THAT WOULD HELP THE APPLICANT ACHIEVE THE GOAL FOR WHICH THEY'RE TRYING TO MEET. UM, I DID NOT HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THE PROPOSED SIGNAGE SIGN ON THE REAR. IT WOULD JUST BE THE ABILITY TO, UM, APPROVE HAVING TWO SIGNS VERSUS ONE. AND I DO BELIEVE THERE MAY BE A MORE SUITABLE ALTERNATIVE FOR THE FRONT AS WELL. SO YOU'RE OKAY WITH THE TWO SIGNS OR YOU BASED ON THE CONFIGURATION OF THE PROPERTY AND THE RELIEF THAT THEY'RE SEEKING TO ENABLE RECOGNITION ON THE REAR OF THE BUILDING. BUT AGAIN, IF THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT IS ABLE TO GET SAID NOMENCLATURE AT THE ENTRANCE TO THE PROPERTY, IT KIND OF ALLEVIATES THE REQUESTS THAT THEY'RE MAKING. OKAY. OKAY. THAT'S, SO THAT BEING SAID, IF THAT WERE NOT AN OPTION, THE TWO SIGNS, I WOULD BE WILLING TO APPROVE THE TWO FOR THE VISUALIZATION OF WHERE THE PROPERTY IS. HOWEVER, I THINK THE SIZE OF WHAT'S IN THE FRONT COULD BE ADJUSTED TO MEET CLOSER TO [01:20:01] THE ZONING CODE. 'CAUSE AS IT IS FROM MY QUICK MATH, UM, WE'RE 37.5% ABOVE, UM, WHAT IS REQUIRED IN THE FRONT. AND THE ACTUAL J IS 50% LARGER THAN WHAT IS REQUIRED. SO THERE IS SOME ROOM FOR A LITTLE BIT MORE TWEAKING. BUT AGAIN, IF THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, LET'S SAY WE'RE ABLE TO GET THE J DOWN BY THE ROAD EVERYWHERE THAT YOU'RE ATTEMPTING TO TURN YOUR TRACTOR TRAILER, HAVING THE TWO E FACING SIGNS THAT MAY ALLEVIATE HAVING TO HAVE THE J UP ON THE BUILDING BUT MAY BE MORE PLEASING JUST OVERALL IN TERMS OF WHAT THE APPLICANT IS SEEKING TO HAVE DONE. SO THE ONE QUESTION, AND I HAVE LIZ, THIS IS FOR YOU. UM, WE SHOULD NOT BE LOOKING AT THIS AS THREE SIGNS. WE SHOULD BE LOOKING AT AS TWO SIGNS CORRECT? THE TECHNICALLY IT'S THREE, THREE SIGNS IT TWO ON THE FRONT, ONE ON THE ONE ON THE REAR, BUT FROM A BUILDING COMPLIANCE BUILDING COM BUILDING COMPLIANCE TWO. OKAY. SO AS LONG AS THE SIGNS WERE IN COMPLIANCE WITH SIZE AND WE DIDN'T COME UP WITH ANOTHER ALTERNATIVE THAT WOULD GIVE THAT FOR DIRECTION FOR TRUCK DRIVERS. RIGHT. I WOULD BE OKAY. AS YOU ARE WITH HAVING TWO SIGNS, BUT HAVING THEM FIT WITHIN THE SIZE REQUIREMENTS. SO I'M OF THE SAME MINDSET AS YOU. I'D LIKE TO HEAR FROM, UH, EVE. WELL, YOU KNOW ME, I MEAN , I'M SORRY. I REALLY AM, THE BUILDING IS HUGE, BUT WHEN YOU DRIVE UP TO IT ON THE FRONT IN A CAR, IT'S EASY TO SEE BECAUSE IT'S, IT'S HIGH AND IT'S VERY OUTSTANDING. SO I DON'T, YOU KNOW, I'M OLD, BUT I, YOU KNOW, CAN SEE DON'T HAVE ANY PROBLEMS WITH WHAT ABOUT THE SIGN ON THE BACK? THE SIGN ON THE BACK IS OKAY. I I THINK WE'RE, THE THREE OF US ARE THE SAME MINDSET NOW. YEAH. AND I, I WOULD GO WITH, UM, THE MIDDLE OPTION, WHICH WAS THE COMPLIANCE SIGN IN THE FRONT. MM-HMM . UM, MY VERY BIG CONCERN WITH GOING ABOVE A COMPLIANT SIGN IS CURRENTLY IT'S A VERY, THE WHOLE COMPLEX IS VERY CLEAN AND CRISP. THERE AREN'T BIG SIGNS WHETHER THERE ARE MULTIPLE PEOPLE IN THE BUILDING OR NOT. YOU CAN HAVE EVERY COMPANY IN THE BUILDING WANT THEIR OWN SIGN ON IT. RIGHT. AND THEN IT STARTS LOOKING VERY JUMBLED. SO I PERSONALLY DON'T FEEL LIKE STARTING A PRECEDENT IN THIS COMPLEX AREA THAT I UNDERSTAND THIS LITTLE PORTION NOW HAS A DIFFERENT OWNER, BUT THAT KIND OF CHOPPING UP TO DIFFERENT OWNERS COULD HAPPEN WITH ALL THE BUILDINGS. AND I, I THINK THERE'S A REAL PRECEDENT ISSUE HERE. UM, SO, AND I THINK THE ALTERNATIVE WITH COMPLIANCE SIGNS, YOU'LL SEE IT. I MEAN, FIRST OF ALL, THE TRUCKS DRIVERS AREN'T SEEING THE FRONT BUILDING OR THE BACK OF THE BUILDING WHEN THEY'RE COMING IN FROM THE MAIN ENTRANCE. SO I, I DON'T, I THINK THE, UH, THE ARGUMENT THAT THEY NEED ALL THESE SIGNS AND THEY NEED THESE BIG SIGNS IS SPECIOUS. UM, I, I THINK THE FIRE DEPARTMENT ISSUE IS REALLY A BIG ONE. AND, UM, THAT'S THE ONE I'D LIKE TO SEE HANDLED. AND I'M NOT SURE THAT IS HANDLED BY PUTTING A SIGN ON THE BACK OF THE BUILDING. RIGHT. UM, AND YOU KNOW, YOU CAN ALWAYS SAY NUMBER 75, THE ONE WITH THE BLUE STRIPE ON TOP, BUT EVEN COMING IN, IF YOU, IF YOU START DOWN FURTHER, I DON'T KNOW, I DIDN'T GO OVER THE BACK FOLLOWING TRUCKS 'CAUSE I STAYED ON CLEAR BOOK. BUT, UM, AS YOU'RE APPROACHING THE BUILDING, YOU'RE GONNA SEE THIS BLACK BUILDING. I MEAN IT'S, IT'S THERE EVEN WITHOUT A SIGN AND EVERYTHING ELSE IS WHITE AT THIS POINT. AND IF WE START GIVING, UM, MUST BE, I'M SORRY. AND IF WE START GIVING SIGNS ON BOTH SIDES OF THE BUILDING, WE HAVE SET PRECEDENT FOR EVERY SINGLE BUILDING IN THE COMPLEX THAT THAT'S NOT CORRECT. IF THEY SHOW A NEED, THEN OTHER PEOPLE WILL HAVE TO SHOW A NEED ALSO. THEY'D HAVE TO SHOW A SIMILAR OR ANOTHER NEED. OKAY. OKAY. SO IT'S NOT THAT EVERYBODY ELSE WOULD JUST GET ONE. THAT'S THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF A VARIANCE, RIGHT? YOU HAVEN'T, YOU SHOW THAT. SO, OKAY. AND YOU MAY NOT THINK [01:25:01] THEY'VE SHOWED A NEED. THAT'S OKAY. I DO. I THINK THEY HAVE THE TRUCK DRIVERS, BUT IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT WE GIVE VARIANCES ALL THE TIME. AND THAT DOESN'T CHANGE THE ZONING LAWS. I I AM I, I AM AT THIS MOMENT AGNOSTIC , I JUST, I JUST WANNA MAKE IT CLEAR THAT THAT DOESN'T MEAN . I'M NOT IN FAVOR, I'M NOT IN FAVOR OF THE REQUEST. THAT'S THAT'S OKAY. JUST IT AS IS IT JUST FOR THE RECORD, JUST IF WE GRANT THIS VARIANCE DOESN'T MEAN THAT EVERY SINGLE OTHER PERSON THAT COMES AND ASKS FOR A CASE AND AND THEY HAVE MADE THE CASE THAT IT'S FACING NOTHING. YES. THE BACK OF THE THE BACK. YES. THE SECOND SIGN FACES, YES. NO ONE, YOU KNOW, FACES TREES, YES. THAT DON'T READ, UM, . I THINK MOST OF THE OTHER BUILDINGS IN THE COMPLEX HAVE TENANTS THAT SHARE THE BUILDING AS OPPOSED TO ONE TENANT THAT HAS THE ENTIRE LOCATION. I COULD BE WRONG, BUT THAT'S WHAT I THINK. BUT IT DOESN'T MATTER. THAT ISN'T THE REQUIREMENT FOR THE SCIENCE DOESN'T MEAN I IF I'M CORRECT, IT DOESN'T SAY YOU HAVE TO OWN THE WHOLE BUILDING, DOES IT? SO WHEN YOU'RE SAYING THAT, I THINK WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS IF YOU HAD TWO COMPANIES, IF YOU HAD THE X, Y, Z BUILDING X, Y, Z COMPANY IN ONE FLOOR OF THE BUILDING AND THE A BC COMPANY AND ANOTHER FLOOR OF THE BUILDING, SURE. BOTH OF THEM WOULD BE ALLOWED TO HAVE SIGNAGE, WOULD THEY NOT? YES, THEY WOULD. SO, SO THE FACT THAT IT'S ONE OWNER IS NOT REALLY GERMANE TO THIS. I WASN'T NECESSARILY TALKING ABOUT ONE OWNER, BUT I WAS TALKING ABOUT HOW LIKELY THERE'D BE OTHER TENANTS THAT HAVE TWO FRONT FRONTAGE SITUATIONS. THAT'S WHAT I WAS ASKING. I THINK BASED ON THE CONVERSATION, WE ACTUALLY HAVE TO WAIT UNTIL WE SEE WHAT LIZ CAN DO WITH ROBERT MARTIN. CAN WE MAKE A CONTINGENT? SO I, I'M, I'M ACTUALLY, I'M DRAFTING AN EMAIL TO ROBERT MARTIN AND IT'S MORE, IT'S MORE ON THE, UM, YOU KNOW, THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT'S PERSPECTIVE FOR A FIRE RESPONSE AND FINDING SOMEBODY. IT'S VERY, UM, THERE'S A LOT OF TENDENCIES IN THAT, THAT DEVELOPMENT. IT MAKES IT VERY CONFUSING, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU'RE RESPONDING TO SOMETHING AT NIGHT, UM, TO FIND SOMETHING. UM, THE, THE PROPERTY AT 75 IS ONE OF THE FEW SINGLE TENDENCIES OTHER THAN, UM, I THINK ONE OTHER, UM, BUT IT'S SET BACK. SO IT IS DIFFICULT TO FIND. SO THERE IS DEFINITELY A NEED FOR SIGNAGE TO BE ABLE TO LOCATE IT. UM, SO I'LL, I'VE DRAFTED THE LETTER. UM, HOWEVER THE BOARD WANTS TO VIEW THE WALL SIGNAGE. THAT'S, UM, I, I WOULD'VE DONE THAT SEPARATE AND APART FROM ANYTHING THAT HAPPENED THIS EVENING, I HAVE A QUESTION THAT IS THE NUMBER OF THE BUILDING CONSIDERED SIGNAGE? NO, WE DO NOT CONSIDER NUMERICS, UM, TO BE SIGNAGE. THE ACTUAL, SO IF THE BACK OF THE BUILDING SAID 75 THERE WOULD, THEY WOULD NOT REQUIRE A SIGN PERMIT. PERMIT. SO SO YOUR BOOK THEY WOULD NOT REQUIRE NO, THAT'S YOUR ADDRESS. IT'S WHAT THE TRUCKERS ARE LOOKING FOR. IS IT NOT THOUGHTS? I DON'T KNOW. I'VE NEVER BEEN A TRUCKER. BUT I MEAN THE NAME WOULD PROBABLY HELP THE TRUCKER. NO, JUST OVERALL THOUGHTS. YEAH. SO WE CAN'T SIT HERE ALL NIGHT NOW , I MAY HAVE MOVED TO NEGATIVE GIVEN THE FACT THAT THE TRUCKERS ARE LOOKING FOR AN ADDRESS AND THE ADDRESS CAN GO ON THE BACKSIDE. UM, OR IT CAN GO ON THE SIDE WHERE THEY'RE ACTUALLY DRIVING UP AND WITH AN ARROW. RIGHT. UM, I'M STILL OKAY WITH TWO SIGNS AS LONG AS THEY MEET THE HEIGHT REQUIREMENTS. DITO? MM-HMM . I'M OKAY. IT'S TO YOU PETER, WHY ACTUALLY, ARE YOU STILL OKAY WITH TWO SIGNS? ARE YOU ASKING EVE OR ARE YOU ASKING ME? NO, EVE, YOU HAD ORIGINALLY SAID YOU WERE OKAY WITH TWO SIGNS. I SAID IF THEY, IF THEY COME DOWN TO WITH, AS LONG AS THEY MEET THE HEIGHT REQUIREMENT. SO WE ACTUALLY HAVE FOUR RIGHT NOW. OKAY. FOR TWO SIGNS. WELL, I'M PERFECTLY WILLING TO GO ALONG WITH THE MAJORITY . OKAY. I MEAN, I, I JUST WANT THEM TO BE [01:30:03] SO WE COULD DO THAT. YEAH. WE GIVE 'EM A VARIANCE FOR A SECOND. UNLESS, UNLESS THEY DON'T WANT IT. UNLESS THEY WANT OFFER, WE'VE TO PR IT. I'M SORRY. WE WOULD HAVE TO PR THAT APPLICANT WOULD HAVE TO, THEY WANT TO DO THAT. CORRECT. OR CHANGE IT OR WHATEVER. ED, DO THEY HAVE TO COME BACK? CAN'T WE DENY ONE VARIANCE AND GRANT THE OTHER? YEAH, WE'VE DONE IT. YEAH, WE CAN DO THAT TONIGHT. JUST GRANT THEM THE VARIANCE FOR THE SECOND SIZE, BUT NOT GRANT THE VARIANCE FOR THE SIZE. THEY DON'T HAVE TO COME BACK. WE CAN DO THAT TONIGHT. DENY ONE GRANT. THE OTHER. WELL THE FRONT IS NON-CONFORMING ALSO. WE CAN NOT GRANT THE VARIANCE THEY'RE SEEKING FOR THE FRONT SIGN FOR APPROVAL. THE WAY THEY HAVE IT. THE WAY THEY HAVE IT. OKAY. WE DENY THAT VARIANCE AND THEN WE GRANT THE VARIANCE FOR THE SECOND SIGN. OKAY. NO, I JUST, THE OTHER SIDE, THE MIDDLE, THE, THIS IS ALL NO, THAT'S, THAT'S PROPOSING THE 24. THAT'S NOT HERE, RIGHT? NO, NO, NO. OKAY. OKAY. THERE'S AN ALTERNATIVE THAT THEY'RE PROPOSING THAT'S NOT BEEN SHOWN US BEFORE. I'M SURE IT'S . OH NO, WE PITCH, THEY SHOWED US THREE. NO, THERE'S A DIFFERENT, I THEY SAY THIS IS WHAT, AND THIS IS WHAT YOU KNOW. YEAH, THAT'S, NO, NO. THIS ONE HAS, UM, 30 INCH LETTERS AS OPPOSED TO 36 INCH LETTERS AS OPPOSED TO 24 INCH LETTERS. BUT THE, THE REAR IS IN COMPLIANCE, THE REARS IN COMPLIANCE. I UNDERSTAND. YES. WELL, IF THEY WOULD LIKE TO COME BACK AND DO THAT, THAT'S FINE. BUT WE CAN'T NO, THEY PROPOSED 30 INCH. 'CAUSE THEY HAVEN'T EVER PROPOSED IT. DID YOU HEAR WHAT? CAN, CAN WE APPROVE WHAT HASN'T BEEN PROPOSED? 'CAUSE IT'S, IT'S LESS THAN WHAT THEY'RE, YES. YOU CAN USE IT TO ANYTHING ONCE MM-HMM . WITHOUT THEM ASKING MM-HMM . WE CAN, WE CAN PRODUCE THAT, BUT THIS IS STILL MUCH LARGER. MM. PERCENTAGES. SO I THINK THEY'RE PROPOSING 66 AND 60 AND THAT DOESN'T, THAT'S SO THAT DOESN'T WORK. YEAH. SO IF THEY REALLY WANT THAT, THEY'D HAVE TO, SO I WOULDN'T APPROVE 66. I THINK THE ISSUE THAT THEY POINTED OUT A FEW TIMES IS THEY NEED A SIGN YESTERDAY. I THINK THAT'S PARTIALLY WHAT'S FUELING THIS. OKAY. UM, SO I'M JUST TRYING TO SAY THAT I THINK THAT, I THINK THEY WOULD RATHER SOMETHING NOW AS OPPOSED TO SOMETHING BETTER LATER. I DON'T KNOW HOW I CAN SPEAK FOR PEOPLE. I'M BEING CLAIRVOYANT. , BY THE WAY, OUR VERNACULAR IS INCORRECT. THIS WHOLE THING IS A LOGO. THIS IS A WORD MARK. AND THIS IS AN EBU. SO WHEN WE, SO WHEN WE LOOK AT IT, WE NEED LIKE LOGO 66 COULD INCLUDE THE WORD MARK TOO. TECHNICALLY I WOULDN'T, I WOULDN'T APPROVE THAT MORE THAN 48. OKAY. BUT YOU COULD COME BACK AND SAY YOU APPROVED THAT FOR 48, WHICH IS AS OF RIGHT. AS OF RIGHT. BUT YOU'LL ALLOW THE LETTERS TO GO TO 30 FROM 24. YOU CAN, YOU CAN SAY THAT TOO IF YOU FELT LIKE IT. IF WE FELT LIKE IT, YES. I MEAN, LOOK, I UNDERSTAND WE'RE GIVING A VARIANCE ALREADY. I UNDERSTAND THAT FOR THE SECOND, I, I WOULD, I WOULD, I WOULD GO ALONG WITH THAT IF OTHER PEOPLE WOULD GO ALONG WITH THAT. OKAY. WHAT'S THAT? SAY THAT AGAIN? 30 INCH ON THE WORD MARK ON THE LETTERS AND AS OF RIGHT ON THE EBU, WHICH IS 48 INCHES. OKAY. WHAT DOES THE HANGING JUDGE SAY? HE'S THINKING YOU, YOU, YOU, YOU WOULD DO WHAT ON THE LETTERS NOW GO TO 30 INCHES. 44. I WOULD GO TO 30 INCHES ON THE LETTERS, BUT ONLY TO 48, WHICH IS AS OF RIGHT ON THE J. WHICH, WHY ARE YOU GOING OVER THE REQUEST? RIGHT? THEY MADE A NEW REQUEST. NO, IT'S NOT GOING OVER. IT'S ACTUALLY LESS. THIS IS ON THE FRONT. [01:35:01] OH, I DID THE WRONG MATH. YES. ON THE FRONT. I DID THE WRONG MATH HERE ON THE FRONT. HOLD ON, HOLD ON. I DID THE WRONG MATH HERE. OH, THEY INCREASE THE LETTERS AND DECREASE THE LOGO. YES. SO IT'S A 25% INCREASE. THEY DECREAS BOTH DECREASED NOW THEY DECREASED BOTH 25% INCREASE ON THE LETTERS. AND, AND AS OF RIGHT ON THE LOGO, I NO PEOPLE, IT WAS, I DON'T IF WE CAN EVEN DO THAT. IT WAS 36 ON THE LETTERS. I KNOW, BUT THEY'VE CHANGED IT TO 30 POTENTIALLY. RIGHT. WHICH IS NOW TWO AND A HALF FEET. SO IT'S A HALF FOOT ABOVE WHAT IS REQUIRED. SO WE NEED TO DO THE RATIO ON THAT 25%. RIGHT, RIGHT. VERSUS 50. YEAH. WHO'S WRITING THIS UP? POTENTIALLY? NOT ME. . YEAH. I HAVE A HARD TIME WRITING IT UP TOO. I'M JUST WONDERING, DOES THE PERSON WHO'S WRITING THIS UP HAS TO BE ABLE TO WRITE IT UP IN A COHERENT FASHION? OKAY. YOU'RE STILL QUIET UP THERE. SO WE, WE'D BE GRANTING TWO VARIANCES. YES. WE'D BE BE GRANTING THE SECOND SIGN, WHICH WE CAN JUSTIFY BECAUSE IT'S FACING THE BACK OF THE BUILDING. IS THAT HOW WE'RE JUSTIFYING THE SECOND SIGN? YES. NO, NO, NO. IT'S FOR THE TRUCKERS FOR DIRECTIONS. THAT'S JUST FOR THE TRUCK. OH, OKAY. NECESSARY FOR THE TRUCKERS. YES. AND HAVING NO IMPACT ON THE NEIGHBORS. YES. OKAY. ON THE NO IMPACT ON THE COMMUNITY. NO, NO IMPACT. OKAY. SO THE, SO THEN THE SECOND QUESTION IS, ONE WOULD ASSUME THAT GOING OVER, UH, 25% IN THE SIGNAGE, UH, REQUEST IS A RELATIVELY MINOR REQUEST. I'M WILLING TO GO WITH THE MAJORITY ON THIS ONE. THE MAJORITY'S QUIET RIGHT NOW. , I THINK WE HAVE ONE, RIGHT? HE HASN'T SAID THAT. OH, HAVE YOU? YOU SAID YES. OH, WOULD I GO WITH THE THIRD? I HAVEN'T SAID IT TO HIM. I WOULD GO WITH, I WOULD GO WITH THE THIRD. OKAY, SO YOU HAVE TWO, YOU'RE STILL NO, CORRECT. LET ME, YES. OKAY. SO YOU ESSENTIAL. SO WE CAN GET FOUR WITH THE 25% BECAUSE I'LL GO WITH THE MAJORITY. I MEAN, YOU KNOW, I, I AGREE THAT WE DON'T WANT TO MAKE PRECEDENTS FOR THIS WHOLE, UH, NEIGHBORHOOD THAT'S GONNA CHANGE THE CHARACTER OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD. I AGREE WITH THAT. I'M JUST, THAT'S WHY I'M, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT HOW WE WRITE THIS UP WHERE WE'RE NOT CREATING PRECEDENTS THAT WE DON'T WANT TO CREATE. I I JUST FEEL LIKE I DON'T UNDERSTAND THE NEED TO, TO, UM, GO ABOVE THE 24 INCH LETTERS. I AGREE ON THAT. I MEAN, I CAN SEE IT. I SEE THE WHOLE ARGUMENT FROM THE AESTHETIC. THAT'S THE PRECEDENT. 20. NO, I KNOW. LOOK, THE PRE, THE PRECEDENT WHERE WE ONLY MAKE ONE VARIANCE IS A MUCH STRONGER PRE, UH, PRECEDENT THAN WHEN WE MAKE TWO VARIANCES. I UNDERSTAND THAT TOO. WHAT YOU SAY APPLICANT DID INDICATE THAT IT'S 200 YARDS FROM THE MAIN ROAD AND AN OBSCURE LOCATION. SO I MEAN THERE, THERE IS A WAY TO POSSIBLY WORD THIS THAT ARTICULATES WHY IT'S A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT THAN IF IT WAS FRONT FACING TO THE MAIN ROAD AND THE PERCENTAGE OF WHAT WE'RE LOOKING TO INCREASE IT BY. YOU HEAR THAT FROM EVERY SHOPPING CENTER, EVERY BIG BOX STORE MM-HMM . AND IT'S JUST, BUT THE PERCENTAGE WISE AS I, YOU WEREN'T HERE, UM, YOU WEREN'T HERE LAST TIME. I, I JUST CAME BACK FROM ARIZONA MM-HMM . AND THE STORES ARE VERY FAR SETBACK AND THEY ARE NOT LARGER. THEY'RE NOT BIG AND THEY'RE ALL COMPLETELY LEGIBLE. AND, AND SO I I UNDERSTAND PEOPLE WANTING TO GRAB THE ATTENTION OF PEOPLE. I UNDERSTAND THAT'S WHAT ADVERTISING IS ALL ABOUT. IF THIS, THE PURPOSE OF THIS IS TO HELP TRUCK DRIVERS NOT GET LOST, I DON'T SEE THE PURPOSE OF LARGER OVER THE ZONING RULES. I MEAN, IF, IF, IF I THINK THE TRUCK DRIVERS NOT GETTING LOST IS THE SECOND SIGN ON THE BACK OF THE BUILDING, THE INCREASING THE SIZE OF THE, THE FRONT OF THE FRONT. THE SIGNAGE ON THE FRONT IS ABOUT VISIBILITY FROM A DISTANCE ON THE ROAD. BUT THIS IS NOT A RETAIL OPERATION. I'M [01:40:01] NOT, I'M NOT, I'M NOT DISAGREEING WITH YOU. IT'S NOT A, NOT RETAIL. I'M NOT DISAGREE WITH YOU. THEY HAVE AN OCCASIONAL SALESPERSON OR A BUSINESS. THE MOST, THE, THE PEOPLE WHO ARE COMING MOSTLY ARE EMPLOYEES. IT, I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE ALLOWED A FOUR INCH LOGO IN 24 INCH LETTERS, BUT AS OF RIGHT, WELL THIS, THIS IS A SITUATION FOR WHAT IS BEST FOR PROTECTING THE, THE, THE ZONING IS NOT NECESSARILY THE AESTHETICALLY THE BEST THING GOING IN MY PERSONAL OPINION, BUT, WELL, I THINK, I THINK IT'S ABOUT THE BUSINESS NEEDS TOO. LIKE WHAT, WHAT DO THEY NEED OR WHAT DO THEY WANT? RIGHT. WHAT DO THEY NEED? WHAT DO THEY NEED FOR VISIBILITY? WELL, THE WAY THEY DESCRIBED THE TRUCKERS COMING IN, IT SHOULD BE ON THE SIDES BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT COMING THAT WAY. DO YOU WANNA TAKE A VOTE? SO SECOND SIGN IS A YES. MM-HMM . SIZE OF SIGN ON THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING. CAN WE JUST GO DOWN YES OR NO? LOOK, I WOULD ABSOLUTELY GO FOR THE SLIGHTLY LARGER SIGN, BUT I ABSOLUTELY THINK ONLY GRANTING ONE PRECEDENT IS BETTER FOR THE ZONING CODE. SO I, I'M THAT, I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO SAY. . I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S NECESSARILY TRUE. I MEAN, AGAIN, IT'S LIKE SOMETIMES PEOPLE COME IN AND NEED VARIANCES FOR 10 DIFFERENT THINGS. RIGHT. BASED ON THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN. I MEAN, IF SOMEBODY HAD, SHOWS A NEED, RIGHT. IT MEETS THE CRITERIA. IT'S NOT ABOUT THE NUMBER OF VARIANCES NECESSARILY. IT'S A SIX INCH INCREASE IN LOGO . IT'S THE SIZE OF MY PHONE. RIGHT. OKAY. UH, IS, IS THAT FROM A HUNDRED FEET? IS THAT REALLY THAT MUCH OF A DIFFERENCE? TO, TO REALLY TO BREAK TO, TO, TO, TO CARE, TO GRANT A VARIANCE IS THAT MUCH NEED FOR A NON-RETAIL PROPERTY. I GUESS I'M USED TO SEEING LAW FIRMS, FOUR LAW FIRMS AND ACCOUNTING FIRMS WILL BE IN THE SAME BUILDING AND THEY WILL STACK ALL THEIR NAMES ON THE OUTSIDE OF A BUILDING. AND I CAN SEE US, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE SAYING, BUT YOU GRANTED IT, YOU GRANTED THE BIGGER LETTERS TO THEM AND YOU START GETTING THAT SORT OF THING HAPPENING. I COULD BE WRONG. I MEAN USUALLY WE, YOU KNOW, OUR SIGNS ARE WE WANT PUBLIC TO SEE US. YES. BUT THIS IS NOT THAT SITUATION. OKAY. WELL THEY STILL HAVE VISITORS. THEY JUST HAVE A DIFFERENT TYPE OF VISITOR. MM-HMM . BUT PEOPLE AREN'T GONNA BE DRIVING BY AND SAY, OH, WHAT IS THAT? OKAY, CAN WE, CAN WE DO THAT VOTE NOW? , WHAT DO YOU WANT TO DO? YOU WANT TO LET THEM DECIDE IF THEY, IF YOU KNOW YOU WANT TO GO DOWN. WELL WE WERE, WE WERE TOLD THAT WE CAN RIGHT NOW MAKE AN APPROVAL AT, AT WHATEVER HEIGHT WE WANT TO SAY. WE DON'T HAVE TO MAKE THEM COME BACK FOR THAT. THAT IS CORRECT. SO WE CAN GRANT THE VARIANCE THAT THEY WEREN'T ORIGINALLY ASKING FOR BUT HAVE SEEMED TO HAVE ASKED FOR SINCE THEN. OR NOT AS LONG AS IT'S SMALL. LESS THAN WHAT ORIGINALLY. [01:45:03] SO THERE WERE TWO VARIANCES WITH RESPECT TO THE FRONT. ONE IS THE HEIGHT OF THE LOGO AND THE OTHER IS THE HEIGHT OF THE LETTER. SO WHY DON'T YOU ADDRESS EACH ONE OF THEM? YOU CAN EITHER, AT THAT POINT, IF IT'S LESS THEY'RE REQUESTING NOW YOU CAN EITHER DO IT AS A CONDITION OR YOU CAN ADJOURN IT AND ALLOW THEM TO COME BACK. YOU FIND WHETHER YOU'RE WILLING TO FURTHER REDUCE WHAT THEY REQUESTED. OH, I, I, YOU KNOW, I I'VE SAID I'M NOT GOING TO APPROVE IT WITH WHAT THEY CAME IN WITH PRIOR TO OUR DE OUR DELIBERATIONS, BUT WE CAN APPROVE THE 30 INCHES. ARE YOU SAYING NO TO THAT? WHAT ARE WE DOING WITH THIS? I SAY NO TO THAT ONE. THERE'S NO ISSUE WITH READABILITY OR FROM THE STREET. I THINK WE'VE GOT A, SO WE HAVE TWO VARIANCES. I WOULD BE WILLING TO GIVE THEM THE 30 INCHES OR THE 25% INCREASE ON THE WORD MARK. BUT NOT ON THE J ON THE LOGO. I, THERE'S REALLY, I DON'T SEE, I DON'T THINK THEY'VE EXPRESSED A NEED TO HAVE IT. I MEAN THAT PROBABLY IS OUTTA PROPORTION FOR THEM COMPARED TO THEIR WORD MARK. BUT FROM A BRANDING PERSPECTIVE. BUT THEY HAVEN'T SHOWN A NEED. BUT IF YOU WERE WILLING TO GO 25% ON THE LETTERS AND YOU WENT 25% FROM THE LOGO, WOULD THE NUMBER COME OUT TO 60, WHICH IS WHAT THEY'RE ASKING FOR? THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE ASKING. NO, THEY'RE ASKING FOR 66. NO, NO, NO. THEY CHANGED IT. THEY CHANGED IT. THEY CHANGED. SO IT'D BE 25% ON THE LOGO. 25% ON THE LETTERS. THEY WENT TO 30 AND 66 INSTEAD OF 36. 30 AND 60. I COULD GO WITH 30 AND 60. OKAY. 60 PLAN BIG. DID I SO YOU HAVE TWO 30 AND 60. THAT'S BIG. UM, 60 IS BIG. WELL, THEY'RE ALLOWED 48 AUTOMATICALLY, RIGHT? THEY'RE ALLOWED 48. THEY'RE ALLOWED 48. ALRIGHT, LET'S GO WITH THE LETTERS AND THE TWO SIGNS. I'M, I'M WILLING TO VOTE ON THAT. OKAY. AND THEN, AND THEN DENY THE LOGO. THE LOGO, OKAY. UNLESS THE LOGO IS IN COMPLIANCE. SO YOU'RE GONNA INCREASE THE LETTERS, BUT THE LOGO IS GOOD. 48. 48. OKAY. WE'VE GOT FOUR ON THAT ONE. I'M OKAY WITH THAT. WITH THE 30. I'M LOOKING ALL THE WAY AT THE END. WHAT? NO, NOT A KIRA . YOU ARE A NO, I'M A NO. WHERE, WHERE ARE YOU NOW? 2, 3, 4. ME? YEAH. I I'M, I'M MORE OF THE 48, 24. YEAH. YEAH. WHAT THE ODDS ARE, RIGHT? RIGHT. I THINK IS SUFFICIENT FOR THEIR NEEDS. RIGHT. I WISH I COULD FEEL POSITIVE ABOUT THE SIGN ON THE BACK, BUT I CAN'T JUST BECAUSE THAT'S OKAY. YOU DON'T HAVE TO. I DON'T HAVE TO ADMIT THAT. OKAY. 'CAUSE WE'RE FOUR TO TWO. EVEN IF EVE, IF YOU DON'T VOTE, IF YOU VOTE NAY, SHE SAID YAY. DID YOU SAY YAY? NO, I DIDN'T SAY THAT. SHE HASN'T SAID ANYTHING YET. I DID SAY YOU SAID 30 AND ASSIGNED WITHOUT, WITHOUT THE UM, THE LOGO THING, WHATEVER. IT'S, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE SAYING. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE SAYING. WE'RE SAYING A YAY ON THE WORD MARK. THE LETTERS AND THEN A NO ON THE LOGO AND COMPLIANCE ON THE LOGO AND A AND YEAH. AND A YES. ON THE SECOND SIGN THAT IS COMPLIANT. I THINK THE BIGGEST GRANT IS THE SECOND SIGN. CORRECT. AND I DON'T THINK THAT'S WHAT I THINK TOO. THAT DOESN'T GET GRANTED ALL THAT OFTEN. . YEAH, . THAT IS CORRECT. CORRECT. RIGHT. [01:50:01] ABSOLUTELY. SO MAYBE THAT'S WHY I SAID, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THEY WANT, AND YOU THOUGHT WE WERE GETTING MAD EARLIER BECAUSE AGAIN, IT ONLY, AND I DON'T WANT TO BUDDY THE WATERS BY ADJOURNING IT, IF ANOTHER SOLUTION DID COME UP THAT THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, AS I SAID IN THE BEGINNING, WE'RE ABLE TO COME UP WITH THE APPLICANT MAY WANT TO RESUBMIT. RIGHT. ARE WE, ARE WE, ARE WE DONE? I DON'T WANNA, I, I REALLY DON'T WANT TO, YOU KNOW, JUST RUSH IT, RUSH IT. . CONSIDERING JUST FOR ARGUMENT SAKE, WHAT IF THE ENTIRE PARK BECAME LETTERS INSTEAD OF PARKING? LOT ONE, PARKING LOT TWO WAS ACTUALLY PARKING LOT. J OH, THAT WOULD BE CONFUSING. . I DON'T CONTROL THAT. BUT WHAT I'M SAYING IS GIVEN THE APPLICANT AN OPPORTUNITY, ONCE THE RENT, THE, UM, THE COMPANY HAS BEEN MADE AWARE OF WHAT THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT MAY WANT TO PRESENT, MAY OTHER OPPORTUNITIES MAY COME UP IS ALL I'M SAYING. I'M NOT SURE WHETHER WHAT THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT WILL BE ASKING ABOUT HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE SIZE OF THE, THE SIGNS ON THE FRONT THAT ONLY GOES TO THE ISSUE OF THE SECOND SIGN. RIGHT. BUT AGAIN, IF GIVEN AN OPPORTUNITY, IT MAY NOT EVEN WANT THE SECOND SIGN. IF IT WAS AFTER ROAD, I MEAN THEY'RE, WHAT THEY WERE REALLY PUSHING FOR APPARENTLY IS TO GET THE TRUCKS THERE AND THEY SAID THAT'S WHERE THE TRUCKS GO. CORRECT. OKAY. SIR, ARE YOU CHANGING YOUR MIND? NO, I, I I I'M JUST RESTATING WHAT I SAID IN THE VERY BEGINNING. OH, OKAY. , UH, LIZ, DOES THE DECISION THAT'S MADE HERE TONIGHT AFFECT WHAT YOUR EMAIL TO NO, IT DOES NOT AFFECT YOUR EMAIL. OKAY. NO. MEANING IF WE GRANT IT AND THEN THEY COME BACK AND SAY THEY CAN GET A DIFF ADDITIONAL SIGNAGE, THEN THEY'RE GONNA END UP AS WELL. IT'S NOT GONNA COST THEM THE ADDITIONAL SIGNAGE. OKAY. CAN YOU APPROVE ONE? CAN YOU APPROVE ONE SIDE, LIKE THE, THE ADDITIONAL SIZE OF THE LETTERS ON THE FRONT AND JUST COME BACK ON REGARDING THE SECOND SIDE, WAITING FOR THE RESPONSE FROM THE, UH, LANDLORD, FROM THE OWNER OF THE, THE MARTIN. YOU ARE ASKING IF WE, YOU CAN ISSUE A PERMIT AFTER YOU GRANT THE VARIANCES AND THEN HAVE THEM COME, COME BACK TO SEEK A LARGER LOGO. C CAN YOU GRANT ONE VARIANCE AND PUT THE OTHER FOR DECISION ONLY? NEXT TIME FOR THE REAR SIGN. IF YOU'RE GOING, IF YOU'RE GOING TO HEAR IT AGAIN, YOU MIGHT AS WELL PUT IT ALL OVER. WELL, I DON'T THINK WE HAVE NEED TO HEAR IT PROBABLY. YEAH, WE DO. OKAY. YEAH, I, I THINK WE SHOULD MAKE A DECISION. I CHANGED MY MIND. JUST, JUST TO PUT IT IN PERSPECTIVE WITH THE DIRECTIONAL SIGNAGE THAT'S IN CLEARBROOK. IT'S JUST A LITTLE RED SIGN BAND THAT IS THE NAME OF THE COMPANY, WHICH IS HELPFUL FOR PASSERBYS AND, YOU KNOW, TRUCK DRIVERS. BUT IN, IN THE DAYTIME, THEY'RE NOT ILLUMINATED. SO THAT'S ANOTHER COMPONENT. UM, THAT OKAY. HAS ANYBODY CHANGED THEIR VOTE? OKAY. SO LET'S, CAN WE MOVE ON THEN? MM-HMM . OKAY. ALL RIGHT. AWESOME. WHERE ARE WE MOVING DECISION? WE'RE ANNOUNCING BACK ON THIS RECORD. WE'RE GOING BACK ON THE RECORD. WHO'S GONNA WE, THE, WHO'S WRITING IT UP? DIANE? I'M NOT WRITING IT UP. . I'M NOT WRITING IT UP. CLEARLY YOU'RE NOT. THOUGHT HOWARD WAS WRITING EVERYTHING. AND NOT THIS ONE. THAT'S BETWEEN PETER AND WILLIAM. YOU CAN SHOOT FOR IT. , I COMPROMISED ON THAT ONE. SO YOU CAN'T JUST PUT IT ON THE RECORD? NO, YOU HAVE TO READ IT AND THEN YOU HAVE TO WRITE IT AND YOU HAVE TO WRITE ONE OF THESE THINGS UP. OH, OKAY. WHICH GOES BY ALL THE, SO WE USED TO WRITE IT, WE USED TO WRITE THEM UP AT THE END OF THE MEETING, BUT WE WOULD BE UP BEING HERE AND LIKE AN EXTRA HOUR LATE STUFF. SO NOW WE DON'T DO THAT ANYMORE. OKAY. OKAY. WE'RE BACK ON THE RECORD. NOT YET. I JUST, WHO'S WRITING THE, IS [01:55:01] HE WRITING? I'M WORKING ON IT RIGHT NOW. OKAY. SO GIVE HIM A COUPLE OF MINUTES. WELL HE DOESN'T WRITE HAVE TO WRITE THE THING. HE JUST HAS TO READ THE TOP. OH, SO YOU WANT TO FIND, YOU WANT ADJUSTED BECAUSE IT'S DIFFERENT MOTION CONDITION THEN. YEAH, HE'S WRITING IT UP. I KNOW HIM. THIS IS WHY WE DIDN'T DO THAT. OKAY, LET'S JUST, OKAY, I GUESS WE COULD TAKE A BREAK. VOTE FOR WATER BACK ON THE RECORD. YOU ONLY KNEW DAY I HAD IT'S NONSTOP. I THINK WE'RE ON THE RECORD. YES. OPEN UP THOSE MICS. DON'T WANNA WAIT FOR ED. GUESS I SAY THE WRONG THING, RIGHT? . POINT OF ORDER. GETTING IN. OKAY. AND WE ARE BACK WITH THE RESULTS OF OUR DELIBERATIONS. AND PAGE 26 0 9 OH OH. UM, MADAM CHAIR, I HAVE A MOTION. YES. OKAY. I MOVE THAT THE APPLICATION IN CASE NUMBER 26 0 9 BE GRANTED. WAIT. YEAH, WAIT TO DO, WE DIDN'T DO THIS SIX. OH, YOU'RE WAITING FOR ME? YES. UH, WHEREAS THE GREENBERG ZBA HAS REVIEWED THE ABOVE-REFERENCED APPLICATION WITH REGARD TO SECRET COMPLIANCE AND NOW THEREFORE THE RESOLVED THAT THE SUBJECT APPLICATION IS A TYPE TWO ACTION REQUIRING NO FURTHER SECRET CONSIDERATION. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. I SECOND. ALL IN FAVOR? AYE. CHAIR VOTES. AYE. DO WE HAVE A MOTION? YES MA'AM. CHAIR, I HAVE A MOTION. I MOVE THAT THE APPLICATION IN CASE NUMBER 26 0 9 BE GRANTED. PROVIDED THAT ONE THE APPLICANT OBTAIN ALL NECESSARY APPROVALS AND FILE SAME WITH THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT. TWO CONSTRUCTION SHALL BEGIN NO LATER THAN 12 MONTHS AFTER THE GRANTING OF THE LAST APPROVAL REQUIRED FOR ISSUANCE OF A BUILDING PERMIT AND PROCEED DILIGENTLY THEREAFTER IN CONFORMITY WITH THE PLANS STAMPED, RECEIVED APRIL 9TH, 2026 SUBMITTED IN SUPPORT OF THIS APPLICATION. OR AS SUCH, PLANS MAY BE HEREAFTER MODIFIED BY ANOTHER APPROVING BOARD OR AGENCY OR OFFICER OF THE TOWN. PROVIDED THAT SUCH MODIFICATION DOES NOT REQUIRE A DIFFERENT OR GREATER VARIANCE THAN WHAT WE ARE GRANTING HEREIN. THREE. THE VARIANCE BEING GRANTED IS FOR THE IMPROVEMENTS SHOWN ON THE PLANS SUBMITTED IN SUPPORT OF THIS APPLICATION. ONLY ANY FUTURE OR ADDITIONAL CONSTRUCTION THAT IS NOT IN CONFORMITY WITH THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE SHALL REQUIRE VARIANCES EVEN IF THE CONSTRUCTION CONFORMS TO THE HEIGHT, SETBACK OR OTHER VARIANCES. WE HAVE GRANT APPROVED HEREIN THE FINDINGS OF THIS WILL BE AVAILABLE, UM, ON THE WEBSITE, UH, IN THE NEXT FEW DAYS. AND ON THE RECORD. AND, AND ARE ON THE RECORD. YES. ALL IN FAVOR? GIMME A SECOND. SECOND. SECOND. SECOND. SECOND. ALL IN FAVOR? I. SECOND. AND ALL APPROVED. ALL IN FAVOR? AYE. AYE. CHAIR. BOTH. AYE. AND THE NEXT CASE IS CASE 26 11 JOAN R. TOOLS AND WHEREAS THE GREENBERG ZBA HAS REVIEWED THE ABOVE REFERENCED APPLICATION WITH REGARD TO CA COMPLIANCE AND NOW THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED THAT THE SUBJECT APPLICATION AS A TYPE TWO ACTION WITH REQUIRE NO FURTHER SECRET CONSIDERATION. YOU WANNA HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. SECOND. ALL IN FAVOR? AYE. AYE. CHAIR VOTES. AYE. AND DO WE HAVE A MOTION? YES. MADAM CHAIR. WE DO HAVE A MOTION. I MOVE THAT THE APPLICATION IN CASE NUMBER 26 DASH 11 BE GRANTED IN PART PROVIDED THAT ONE THE APPLICANT OBTAIN ALL NECESSARY APPROVALS AND FILE THE SAME WITH THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT. CONSTRUCTION SHALL BEGIN NO LATER THAN 12 MONTHS AFTER THE GRANTING OF THE LAST APPROVAL REQUIRED FOR THE ISSUANCE OF A BUILDING PERMIT AND PROCEED DILIGENT THEREAFTER IN CONFORMITY WITH THE REVISED PLANS DATED JULY 6TH, 2026 AND STAMPED AND RECEIVED JULY 6TH, 2026 SUBMITTED IN SUPPORT OF THIS APPLICATION. [02:00:02] ACTUALLY, UM, NO. WE NEED TO CHANGE THAT. THAT WILL BE JULY. WHAT IS THE DATE? 18TH 16TH JULY 16TH. UM, SUBMITTED IN SUPPORT OF THIS APPLICATION OR SUCH PLANS MAY BE HEREAFTER MODIFIED BY ANOTHER APPROVING BOARD OR AGENCY OR OFFICER OF THE TOWN. PROVIDED THAT SUCH MODIFICATION DOES NOT REQUIRE A DIFFERENT OR GREATER VARIANCE THAN WHAT WE ARE GRANTING HEREIN. THE VARIANCE IS BEING GRANTED ARE FOR THE IMPROVEMENTS SHOWN ON THE PLANS SUBMITTED IN SUPPORT OF THIS APPLICATION. ONLY. ANY FUTURE OR ADDITIONAL CONSTRUCTION THAT IS NOT IN CONFORMITY WITH THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE SHALL REQUIRE VARIANCES EVEN IF THE CONSTRUCTION CONFORMS TO THE HEIGHT SETBACK OF OTHER VARIANCE WE HAVE APPROVED HEREIN. SO IF YOU DENYING THAT'S WHAT I SAID IN PART I DIDN'T GET TO THE FINDINGS. I WHAT YOU GRANT. OH, WELL I THOUGHT YOU HAVE TO SAY WHAT YOU GRANT. YEAH, WE DIDN'T GET TO THE GRANT FINDINGS YET, THOUGH. YOU WANT TO SAY IT UP FRONT? OKAY. DO YOU WANNA DO THE FINDINGS NOW OR NO? WHAT ARE YOU GRANTING? I THOUGHT YOU WERE GRANTING WE ARE GRANT. OKAY. THAT'S WHAT THERE WERE. YEAH. RIGHT. SO WE ARE DENYING, OKAY, HERE WE GO. SO WE'RE GONNA SET IT FORTH. WE ARE DENYING. OKAY. SO AS JUST WASN'T THERE YET, BUT, OKAY. UM, WE ARE, HOW ARE WE GONNA PRESENT THIS ? WE'RE GOING TO DENY THE APPLICANT'S REQUEST FOR THE SIGNED LOGO, A REQUEST OF FOUR FOOT VERSUS, EXCUSE ME, FIVE FOOT, WHICH REQUIRE, WHICH THE REQUIREMENT WAS FOUR FEET. HOWEVER, WE ARE GOING TO APPROVE THE LOG LETTERING, WHICH WOULD BE A 25% INCREASE ABOVE THE, THE REQUIRED OR THE PERMITTED, WHICH IS TWO FOOT, WHICH WILL BE A TWO AND A HALF FOOT SIGN. WE'RE ALSO GONNA APPROVE A SECOND WALL SIGN, WHICH WILL BE AT THE REAR OF THE BUILDING, WHICH WILL BE IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE ZONING CODE. YOU MEAN THAT SECOND ONE? THE SECOND ONE. THE SECOND SIGNAGE WILL BE WITHIN THE ZONING CODE. AND WHAT AND WHAT ABOUT THE, UH, WE ARE DENYING THE LOGO. OKAY. AND THE SECOND SIGNAGE IS WORD IS ONLY LETTERS WORD MARK ONLY. CORRECT. ALRIGHT. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. ALL IN FAVOR? AYE. AYE. AYE. CHAIR VOTES? AYE. DO YOU WANNA DO THE FINDINGS NOW OR ALL OPPOSED? YOU VOTED NO. OH, ALL OPPOSED? PARDON ME? ALL OPPOSED? OH, I'M SORRY. . WAIT, IT'S ON THE RECORD. NO, NO, YOU HAVE TO SAY IT. YOU HAVE TO SAY IT. ALL RIGHT. EVA'S NOT A YAY. SHE'S A NAY. OKAY. SHE'S A NAY AND I AM A NAY. NAY. THANK YOU. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. OKAY. OKAY. SO ME REDO THIS AGAIN. OKAY. IF YOU AGREE WITH THE FINDINGS. YES. CAN WE JUST SUBMIT THIS WITH THE A? OKAY. FINDINGS, THE APPLICANT OWNS A PROPERTY IN THE PD, NON-RESIDENTIAL PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICT ZONE ZONING DISTRICT, AND PROPOSES TO ONE IN ORDER TO INSTALL A NEW WALL SIGNAGE ON THE SUBJECT PROPERTY. IN ORDER TO DO SO, THE APPLICANT REQUIRES THE FOLLOWING VARIANCES FROM THE PROVISIONS OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE FROM WHICH WE ARE DENYING THE LOGO SIGN, WHICH THE REQUEST WAS FOR A FIVE FOOT SIGN. WHERE FOUR FOOT IS IS THE, UM, PERMITTED, MAXIMUM PERMITTED, MAXIMUM PERMITTED. WE ARE APPROVING FROM SECTION 24 DASH 3D SUBSECTION 13 A TO INCREASE THE MAXIMUM HEIGHT OF SAID LETTERS FROM TWO FOOT PERMITTED TO THREE FOOT, PROPOSED A 20. JUST MAKE IT TWO AND A HALF. MAKE IT CLEAR. THAT'S FOR THE FRONT SIGN. FOR THE FRONT SIGN. 30 INCHES, 30 INCHES, WHICH IS TWO AND A HALF. TWO AND A HALF FEET. A 25% INCREASE. THEN WE ARE ALSO APPROVING. AND THE REAR, WE ARE APPROVING THE ADDITION OF A REAR SIGN, WHICH WILL BE IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE ZONING ORDINANCE, WHICH IS SECTION TWO 40 DASH THREE C SUBSECTION NINE TO INSTALL A WALL SIGN ON A NON CORNER LOT FACING CLEARBROOK ROAD. UM, SECOND WALL SIGN, WHICH WILL BE IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE ZONING CODE AND GRANTING THIS APPLICATION, THE ZONING BOARD HAS WEIGHED THE BENEFIT TO BE DERIVED BY THE APPLICANT FROM THE PROPOSED VARIANCES AGAINST THE IMPACT THAT THE VARIANCES MIGHT HAVE ON THE HEALTH, SAFETY AND WELFARE THE NEIGHBORHOOD COMMUNITY. AFTER DOING SO, WE HEREBY FIND THAT ONE GRANTING THE VARIANCES [02:05:01] WILL NOT AT UND, WILL NOT RESULT IN AN UNDESIRABLE CHANGE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD OR DETERMINATE TO THE NEARBY PROPERTIES, PROVIDED THAT THE CONDITIONS ARE FULLY COMPLIED WITH. TWO, THE GOALS THAT THE APPLICANT CANNOT BE ACHIEVED BY SOME OTHER FEASIBLE MEANS WITHOUT OBTAINING THE VARIANCES WE ARE GRANTING DUE TO THE SETBACK OF THE PROPERTY OF MORE THAN 200 YARDS FROM THE ADJACENT ROAD. THREE, THE REQUESTED VARIANCES ARE SUBSTANTIAL IN RELATIONS TO THE RELIEF BEING SOUGHT. UM, INCREASE OF TWO AND A HALF FEET COMPARED WITH TWO FEET PERMITTED A 25% INCREASE, AS WELL AS HAVING THE SECOND SIGN COMPARED WITH THE ONE SIGN PERMITTED AN INCREASE OF A HUNDRED PERCENT FOUR. UH, WE ARE GRANTING THE VARIANCES WILL NOT HAVE AN ADVERSE EFFECT ON IMPACT OF THE PHYSICAL OR ENVIRONMENTAL CONDITIONS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD OR DISTRICT IE DRAINAGE, STEEP SLOPES, WETLANDS, AESTHETICS, VIEW SHED IMPERVIOUS SURFACE FLOODING CONDITIONS. ETC, THE APPLICANT'S NEED FOR THE VARIANCE WAS SELF-CREATED BECAUSE THE APPLICANT PURCHASED A PROPERTY WITH THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE. HOWEVER, THE FACT THAT AN APPLICANT'S NEED IS SELF-CREATED DOES NOT BY ITSELF, REQUIRE US TO DENY AN AREA OF VARIANCE. THANK YOU. . WELCOME. ALRIGHT, SO I HOPE EVERYONE HAS SUCKED UP ENOUGH S SMOG FROM CANADA, BUT THEY SAY IT'S GONNA GO RIGHT AWAY. AND PEOPLE WHO WERE IN NEW YORK TODAY SAID THAT IT'S HORRIBLE. WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT DONE YET. WE, YOU MY SHEET. OH, WE NEED TO ADJOURN THE MEETING. OKAY. SHEET. OH, THIS HAS THE WRITING THAT THEY SENT. OH, THAT'S, AND WE, AND WE ARE ADJOURNED. WE NOW ARE IN, IN SUMMER . AND WE WILL SEE YOU ALL ON AUGUST 20TH. DO YOU HAVE THIS? THANK YOU. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.